YNAB Price Change 2021

Hey all,

You’ll see an in-app message today with more information on the upcoming pricing change that will impact your next renewal. We know—especially for a YNABer—that every dollar counts, and we don’t take price changes lightly.

Questions or feedback about the change can be shared below. Please check out our FAQs for more details, or questions that may have already been addressed.

If you have questions about your account, you can reach out to our Support team from the app on web or mobile.

We hope and trust you’ll continue seeing the value of a YNAB subscription.


  • New topics or comments in other areas of the Support Forum will be directed to this thread.
  • We understand the impact that price changes can have. Please keep our Community Guidelines in mind.
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  • Keep an eye on alternatives like https://lunchmoney.app folks. It doesn't currently appear to handle budgeting the same way YNAB does so probably isn't a suitable alternative right now, but holy smokes does it look like its solo creator has accomplished a great deal in a relatively short time period.

    Like 3
      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Silver Viper I'm wary of a full-fledged app that only has one person behind it. Very different from someone selling an old spreadsheet template.

      Like
      • pgauntlett
      • pgauntlett
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Silver Viper Actual Budget seems to me to be the best match. www.actual budget.com

      Like 1
  • I'm sorry, but for me the doubling of the price is completely unacceptable. I took out the subscription when the "$ 45 Lifetime" offer came out. It's a shame, I was totally convinced of the program and often recommended it to others, unfortunately I often lacked the arguments to justify the price. But what is happening now, I find absolutely not okay, especially since I cannot use YNAB to the full extent, as no German banks are supported. I think I'll cancel the subscription then, as sorry as I am.

    Like 8
  • As a long time ynab user it saddens me to say that I will be canceling my subscription! I wish I still had my YNAB4 but alas I was going to MINT! I was paying $45 for my subscription I will not be playing close to 100 when I can just go to mint for free!!!!! 

    Like 3
  • Sorry but I will not be renewing!!! It's one thing to increase us slowly from the 45 that I was paying but to double it in one fell swoop is just not something I'm going to swallow! I will be going to mint which is free until I figure out exactly what program I would like to use... It sucks because I've been with ynab since YNAB4... I love it but I'm not paying $100 for it. 

    Like 4
  • YNAB lifer here! 

    Switched to nYNAB from YNAB4 to support the team. What I didn't like? Credit card management, can't carry over negative balance, difficult to manage paydays, and the yearly cost of 45$ But it was for the good guys/girls at YNAB, so we kept with it. 

    No email about the sudden hike in price? Just a little pop-up in their shinny phone app... YNAB has gone from a small company helping people budget to whatever this is. 

    Just cancelled my subscription. Downloaded YNAB4 and am SUPER excited to go back to the flexibility that the classic version provided. Not sure if I can continue telling people about this amazing budgeting tool, so sad :( 

    The end of an era.

    Like 14
    • wesleyyoung where did you download ynab4 again?

      Like 1
    • wesleyyoung thank you unfortunately the lookup feature is only showing my YNAB3 code... Ugggg..

      Like
    • Tomato Griffin message support and ask them for it.

      Like
    • wesleyyoung To be clear, YNAB4 needs to be converted to 64 bit somehow (not sure how that works) and will NOT offer any kind of iPhone sync/entry. It'll purely be a macOS app that you use on your primary computer (not mobile device) and manage your finance there.

      If I can figure out the 64-bit conversion and find the email with the key, it doesn't sound bad, to be honest.

      Like 1
      • pgauntlett
      • pgauntlett
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Pickle of the North this 64 bit adaptor worked for me! https://gitlab.com/bradleymiller/Y64

      Like 2
    • pgauntlett Thank you very much! I'll have a look for sure.

      Like
    • Pickle of the North that’s a deal breaker for me, sadly :( Having YNAB on my iPhone, with a custom shortcut automation on my home screen (from the iOS Shortcuts app) to launch straight into logging a new transaction from my primary credit card with no friction (one I pay off in full and earn cashback for using, lest anyone think I’m being reckless instead of responsible!), has become a totally ingrained habit for me over the years (though the shortcut is only about a year old, it streamlines the somewhat clunky manual process I was using before). Having the app with me at all times is critical.

       

      I have ADHD (just realised my YNAB subscription predates my ADHD diagnosis by at least 6 months, and that has already become internalised as just one particular yet permanent fact of my life, which I thought also applied to YNAB!!), and without that instant access to log purchases at the time of making them, the whole process becomes so much more laborious to go through later when sitting down with my Mac and online banking apps; so much so that in times of laziness and thinking I’ll get around to logging that one thing later, I’ve lapsed into getting multiple months behind with my logging and budgeting. Fortunately that hasn’t created any disasters, because I’ve got to the point of ageing my money up to at least 6 months now (after also saving up for a holiday to Thailand taken at short notice some years ago, the purchase of so many big-ticket items like various electronics and new furniture, and literally also buying a flat! Okay, so I live in London and it’s mortgaged up to the hilt and not something I technically “bought”; the app isn’t made of magic! 😂), but it’s enough to know that I need a solution I can take with me. Alas.

       

      I’m saving up the links  and recommendations from other replies in this thread though, and will definitely be checking out the options.

      Like
    • Emmavescence You could probably easily enough set up a shortcut to just tell siri to add to a list of transactions on the go. Then you'd have a complete list that you could input and check off at your leisure. It's an extra step to be sure, but it'd keep you rolling using YNAB4 if you wanted. That's my current plan, although people are starting to sell me on Banktivity. I'll have to look.

      Like
  • I've been using YNAB since college (2008!).

    I love all the courses, the blog posts, the lessons, etc.  The entire program really changed my perspective and relationship with money.

    I think over the years I've singlehandedly recruited at least 8 others, the most recent being about 1.5 years ago.

    However, I've been living abroad for 4 years now, and so everything I do is manual; I'd be willing to pay another 10 or 20 per month IF my EU bank was supported, but a doubling in price with no feature upgrades....not worth it to me....perhaps I'll go back to the YNAB4 version.

    Like 9
  • You really like to challenge your legacy customers, huh, in-app message instead of email for this important and emergency change.

    I am the poor guy come from Taiwan who used less than full featured nYNAB and suffered from intended behavior issue when I entered Traditional Chinese memo.

    But it was fine because the reason I was crazy for YNAB4 didn’t change -you’ve kept teaching and delivering correct financial concepts while you published the app. I still remember how shocked I was when I heard “Give every dollar a job” this concept.

    I didn’t have a plan to leave even though there are some nice, lower price and without localization issues budget app in Taiwan, but obviously, I need to consider it again after this morning.

    In my opinion, it is a very rough and rude change. “You need a budget”, I like it when it means a suggestion to help people out of financial problem. I don’t want it to be your destiny…but who knows, maybe the CEO or the marketing manager deserves The Nobel Economics Prize.

    It's sad to write down my first comment in this way.

    Like 6
    • There are many amazing alternatives were mentioned in this thread, it is eye-opener.

      I also want to introduce one alternative solution I found, it calls MOZE, only support Apple devices, including Apple Watch. It is worth seeing.

      Like
  • Obviously nobody likes price increases. That being said, as long as this doesn't become the norm, I can still justify the annual cost of YNAB for the amount of time/frustration/hassle/stress it saves me.

    Also, as a fellow business owner, I get it. You can't run sustainably at the same price forever, especially in this economy.

    Again, I hope price increases don't become the norm, but for now, I am still standing behind YNAB because I believe in their product and also in their amazing support.

    Like 1
  • Another long term “legacy” user here that has been around since 2011 and recommended the solution to countless friends, coworkers, and family over the years. The complete disregard for what was committed to us as grandfathered pricing while also literally doubling our cost overnight will be the end of the road for me. I absolutely respect any businesses right to charge whatever they want for their products/ services. I also absolutely believe that when customers are treated poorly and with dishonesty, that people should register their displeasure to attempt to change the situation for something reasonable. Absent an accommodation from the business, it is time for the impacted customers to exercise their own right to terminate the relationship. That is exactly what I will be doing when my subscription expires unless YNAB changes course and honors what was promised to us. It isn’t even so much about the dollars to me, as much as it is about not honoring what was previously communicated and expecting us to just swallow a 2x price increase. 

    Like 14
    • Matt hear hear.

      I am at least encouraged to see so many people saying exactly the same as the comment I left (I didn’t read any other replies before leaving my own comment, but I feel so strongly about it I’m apparently going back to read all of them).

      Not that (almost) unanimous consensus is enough to change the harsh customer-hostile reality of what they’re doing (…unless it does, in which case I’m totally here for it, and would definitely reconsider my exodus plans as a result), but I at least feel that my reaction and feelings on this are validated (and vindicated).
       

      Warm fuzzy feelings don’t pay for outrageous subscription price hikes though.

      Like 3
  • I appreciate your transparency in pricing. I am happy to continue paying for YNAB and get far more than $100/year value from the app. I prefer a flat-fee model like this over having to pay for each feature individually or having my data sold.

    Like 2
  • I'm a long time user, first time poster. I've used YNAB for over 8 years, recommended to countless other people. I appreciate what using YNAB has taught me and found the 'grandfathered' price entirely reasonable. An effective 100% price increase is not acceptable though. If another option for legacy users  is not identified I will be cancelling my subscription.

    Like 16
  • What has everyone updated their emoji to?

    Like 7
    • CarrJar it’s lumped in with my other annual subs category so I’ve updated my profile photo in protest instead

      Like 1
    • CarrJar thank you for the suggestion! 😆 

      P.S. It’s yellow; not because I haven’t added the price-gouging increase catch up amount (which I don’t think I’m going to do, and am instead going to use the time to find a suitable alternative with a company that hasn’t treated me like dirt), but because I get paid on 15th - another scenario YNAB doesn’t support super well, leading to me breaking up my scheduled monthly outgoings into “before payday” and “after payday”,  so when I get paid I go in and budget everything in  “weeks 3-4” for this month, “weeks 1-2” in next month, and take care of all the annual or long term categories in this month’s budget too.

       

      (a strong secondary contender for my emoji: 🤑… except I can’t stand to look at that stupid little happy face, taking delight in the repudiation of its customer-centric values and approach!)

      Like 1
  • Have they responded yet to the fact that they have a Tweet on their official Twitter account saying "lifetime discount $45/year"? This is the part that feels misleading to me. 

    Like 5
      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Mani yes, their response is that it was mis-interpreted, and that it's the 10% discount that is lifetime, not the price itself.

      Like 2
      • Habanero Salsa
      • Second generation user
      • Aquamarine_Pony.8
      • 1 mth ago
      • 13
      • Reported - view

      nolesrule You know, it’s not so much the price increase as the bald-faced lie. It doesn’t say “lifetime 10% discount.” It says “lifetime…$45/year.” It cites the price, not the discount. That’s not a misinterpretation. It’s simply a straight up lie to loyal customers and it’s pretty hard to support that with my money. 

      Like 13
      • Mani
      • Mani
      • 1 mth ago
      • 3
      • Reported - view

      nolesrule I'm not sure how anyone could misinterpret this, bummer. Oh well, they've played their hand. I'll be watching this space to see what YNAB alternatives you all come up with. Ideally I'd like something as close to the format YNAB uses that has an iOS & macOS option. 

      Like 3
      • Annieland
      • I was told there would be no math.
      • Annieland
      • 1 mth ago
      • 3
      • Reported - view

      nolesrule Assuming I accept that explanation, as some communications do seem to suggest that (while others don't), why didn't they bump us when they had the previous massive price increase of something like 65%?  As I've mentioned before, I was totally ignorant to that price hike for the longest time because I was just focusing on my own price.  I think the fact that our price has never budged is what is leading to much of this confusion.

      Like 3
      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Annieland I'm not apologizing for them. Just regurgitating their stance.

      Personally, I think they could have managed it with annual incremental price increases until they got up to the retail price and it would have been better accepted regardless.

      Like 2
      • Annieland
      • I was told there would be no math.
      • Annieland
      • 1 mth ago
      • 3
      • Reported - view

      nolesrule Oh I know you're not.  I'm with you that some of their communications do suggest merely a guaranteed discount and not the price.  That's why I'm just wondering why we didn't get a proportional bump in 2017, unless I missed a communication like "Don't worry valued longtime customers, we got you covered for a while!"

      Like 3
    • I also frankly feel like even if we did misinterpret this...the fact that *so many* people misinterpreted it in *the exact same way* means that the company has some responsibility there...if nothing else, it's a pretty huge failure in the communications department.

      Like 12
    • nolesrule 

       

      doesnt say a word about 10% 

      YNAB [email protected] via infusionmail.com

      Happy New Year YNABers! 

      On Dec. 30th, we launched the new YNAB—an entirely new web app with major new features like Direct Import of transactions from your bank, Goals, and Age of Money. We believe it will be the best YNAB yet. 

      In the heat of the launch, we’ve been slow to proactively reach out and let you know about these changes, and we’re sorry about that! There are a lot of changes, so you’re bound to have some questions! 

      Here is what you need to know about YNAB 4 

      • YNAB 4 is still all yours. You don't have to switch! We’ll officially support it all through 2016 (keep it running great!) and then unofficially for as long as possible. YNAB 4 resources are here.
      • The new YNAB is a paid upgrade. Five dollars per month, or $45/year for you, because you’re a YNAB 4 customer. (If you purchased YNAB 4 recently, you’ll get the new YNAB free for several months.)
      Like 1
      • Lego
      • lego
      • 4 wk ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      nolesrule you shared their response to the tweet... have you seen an official response to the posting of Jesse's email from Nov 2017 "We are adjusting our price... But the pricing change will not affect you if you already have a YNAB account; you are grandfathered in with the existing price." That is VERY clear. He didn't say 'you wouldn't normally be kept at $45 but we're being extra nice right now but don't expect it next time.' I haven't seen them address this at all. They just keep gaslighting us saying they didn't say it and we're all wrong.

      Like 1
  • How do I opt out of the "white-glove" support that I don't use to keep the cost lower?

    Also, this price hike seems very unfair to the folks who are using the app to get out of poverty, maybe consider a lower price tier for those individuals? 

    Like 11
      • Max
      • YNAB Class of 2007
      • Max
      • 1 mth ago
      • 11
      • Reported - view

      Powder Blue Colt "White Glove Support" isn't responding to email in a timely fashion today.  Crickets.

      Like 11
    • Powder Blue Colt 

      Powder Blue Colt said:
      How do I opt out of the "white-glove" support that I don't use to keep the cost lower?

       AAAAYYYYYYYYYY--MEN!!!

      If they gave a fig, they'd offer a tier that kept the price the same but excluded the support that people only use for a few months and then pay for in perpetuity.

      Like 4
    • Max  “White glove support “ also shut off chat… I guess they aren’t interested in hearing what people have to say. 

      Like 3
  • I am joining the  complaints bandwagon. I am a legacy YNAB4 user. I do not live in the US, so bank account linking is meaningless to me. In my country, Argentina, I make USD 19.500 or 9750 a year (depending on how you measure it, due to the exchange rate turmoils here). Here we pay a 65% tax on purchases made on US dollars, so YNAB's original price of USD45 is USD82 for me. Now, with the price hike, it goes up to USD 147. It just kills me. 
    In the last couple of years I didn't touch YNAB but stayed subscribed, out of brand loyalty, because it worked great when I needed it.

    Now, unless there's some kind of tiered system (or even regional prices!) that keeps YNAB accessible I'll drop out when the time for my renewal comes

    Like 7
  • Pat C said:
    But actually the more I think about it, the more offensive it all is.

     Well said, I'm in the same boat but I'm unfortunately a "hostage customer" and will have to stick with it til we're debt-free as I'm not too familiar with other options and don't want to leave the only thing that's made things work for me thus far

    Like 4
    • Hannah “Hostage customer” hits me in the feels. I felt like this when they went SaaS and now even more. I don’t WANT to find a different application as this one and I have years of history and I’m very comfortable with it. But it’s looking like the folks at YNAB don’t actually want me as a customer. 

      Like 6
    • “Hostage customer” is exactly how I feel too.  I have been that way for along time.  At least once a year I go searching for a replacement and am never able to find anything comparable.  At one point I even made my own but was never happy with it.  I would be ok with the higher price if ynab would listen to their customers and develop some of the requested features.   

      Like 6
      • Budget_NC
      • Tomato_Snow_237e7f17927
      • 1 mth ago
      • 5
      • Reported - view

      JDCollector I'm easy.  I just want a check number field back in my checking account.  And not just in the toolkit when I'm on a computer.  It's the little things.🙂

      Like 5
    • Budget_NC I refuse to use the toolkit, I dont trust a third party for accuracy when they are completely dependant on ynab not changing any piece of their site.  It blows my mind why ynab doesnt implement most of those features directly in their app.  That right there is a red flag, shows they really dont listen to their customers.

      Like 4
  • I will happily pay the new price.  I look at it this way:  I have been using YNAB for 1 year, and have never been  this solid, financially speaking.  The clarity gained over the last year has been invaluable - certainly more than $130 CDN.  Its taught us to plan ahead, prioritize and see where there were leaks.  To me and my partner, the $20 CDN to cover the increase in subscription has been found many times over the last year through budgeting.

    At $50, $83 or $99, the return you get from using YNAB is well worth the cost of admission.

    Like 1
    • PS Every year, forever? YNAB has been great, but I'm really against the subscription model and knew that in some stages of life, I may decide to make a more homegrown tool. 

      YNAB has just brought that to the forefront. 

      Like 3
    • Move Light Sound Life You mean you aren't excited to fork over $500 over the next five years for a spreadsheet? (That's assuming they won't hike the price again over the next five years, which they 100% will do.)

      Like 4
      • PS
      • Maroon_Trombone.16
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Move Light Sound Life sure - why not?  It does everything I want it to.  WHy re-invent the wheel?  Your time to build a homegrown tool is much less than the $100 YNAB costs.

      Like
      • PS
      • Maroon_Trombone.16
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Gray Captain you don't think you could find a way to 'find' $100 per year over the next 5 years through YNAB to make it worth it?

      Like
    • PS Nope. It would have to be $100 that only YNAB is actually able to save me, that no other alternative would have been able to. If I could 'find' the same $100 through Mint for free, or the same $100 through another service like Monarch or Copilot (which may cost the same but haven't destroyed any goodwill I have towards them as YNAB has), then I'll just utilize the other service, thank you. I highly doubt that YNAB alone will be able to 'find' me money that an alternative wouldn't.

      Like 3
    • Move Light Sound Life See, in general I’ve reached the point where I’m okay about annual subscriptions, because it generally equates to an app developer being able to dedicate more time and effort to continuous improvements, as well as ensuring compatibility with new OS upgrades and such; compared to one-off costs supporting a model more like withholding improvements and features until the next “big release”, which you have to pay for to access, and having the old version you did pay for just languishing with potential bugs and lack of features, before it loses compatibility altogether with the OS(s) you’re running.
       

      I also really like the sort of features that incur repeated costs to make available, like server-side hosting and sync between devices; but I’m ok with paying a subscription cost to get those, because I know and accept they aren’t free! 1Password is another good example of this - a lot of people were angry when they switched to a subscription model, but they offered additional features that weren’t possible with their previous purchase model, and it turns out those were features I wanted (I wasn’t a 1P customer before this subscription switch, and, like YNAB, I joined at around the time when both models were options you could choose from, depending on which best fit your needs). 

       

      I also listen to a lot of tech podcasts, and have heard countless developers talk about the absolute boon to their business the subscription model has been, because they have a more predictable and steady income instead of one with peaks and troughs around big releases, and can properly dedicate their time towards continuous improvement to support their long-standing customers, instead of feeling they have to focus on flashy new bells and whistles to “justify” a new one-off purchase of a new version. The app “Drafts” is another great example of this - the developer Greg Pierce is a one-man operation, and the amount of developer time and effort he’s been able to put into improving the app and adding new features since switching to a subscription model is incredible (look up his interviews on podcasts like “Mac Power Users” on Relay FM if you want to hear more from his perspective - I’m just a fan, of him/his app/MPU/Relay FM 😊)

       

      I am very aware of the increasing amount I’m paying for subscriptions though, and at some point I do have to draw a line and not contribute towards every app and content creator I would like to support (and gain their paid benefits in return), because it makes my own finances unsustainable.

       

      But it’s one thing when I can see a benefit in opting for a subscription option and increased price to me over time, where it brings definite benefits and features that I want, compared to this, which is “pay double, or get out”; which (unsurprisingly) leads to me taking a very different tack than exalting the app and developer(s) in unrelated conversation online, like I’m doing here with 1Password and Drafts.

       

      YNAB could learn a lot from the likes of Greg Pierce and Dave Teare, when it comes to respecting their customers when changing the financial structure of their app.

      Like 6
      • Agent99
      • Working to Get Smart at budgeting, finances and life
      • Agent99.1
      • 1 mth ago
      • 3
      • Reported - view

      Emmavescence YNAB has struggled with managing their backlog and using their development resources to release features that have real meaning to their users.  I would really like to know what Personas their Product Owners have developed.  YNAB also has LONG struggled with customer communication.  You think the communication around this price increase was bad.   You should have seen the rollout of nYNAB.  It was awful!  YNAB has built a culture of appearing to care about their customers while internally they are completely tone deaf.   I can't say why or how that became the case but it's what I've seen especially over the last 5-6 years of YNAB history.    It sad they continue squander goodwill... The market forces need to come into play and blow them away. 

      Like 3
    • Emmavescence I can respect that. I'd much rather invest in something so that it can be had later, when money is tighter.

      If I had bought DVDs with the money I paid for Netflix, then when things get tighter, I could at least rewatch stuff that had been good enough to buy. However, the subscription model says there shall be no watching unless you continuously pay. 

      Same for books.  Same for software. And hardware, even. The computer I grew up on lasted over a decade. The same brand now seems to age out (of functionality, not just cool, new popularity) after 3-5 years max.

      I grew up in a time where libraries were nixing their reference sections and teachers would say we didn't need books - we could just look up everything online. I wish I had my old textbooks, or even that the fees I paid for online journal subscriptions had gone to something more substantial than memories that I could keep.

      Subscriptions started being a big thing in college, which was great - we could have access to all these things that would have otherwise needed to wait and save up for. 

      But again, the subscription model of the world means that the household either needs to generate a large enough disposable income to cover other people's packages, or they need to do without. 

      If I'm working with limited income (or high expenses), I'm going to pick and choose what I need. I'll wait until the movie is released on dvd instead of going to the theater. I'll mend my own clothes instead of buying new. I'll cherish the few good X I have instead of paying for a subscription of seemingly endless (but also seemingly curated, but not by me) X.

      Certain things, as you say, have perpetual costs. Web hosting, device syncing, property taxes, internet service (arg), financial institution import, fending off security threats, etc. I think those really have to be a subscription model because of evolving threats.

      But who ever heard of renting a hammer? A calculator?  Larger tools are available for rent, presumably for one-off jobs. If it's a tool I would rely on much in the future (like a budget), I would rather invest.

      While I don't use direct import and don't want that cost, I appreciate that YNAB needs to maintain security of my data since they're housing it. I could live without the mobile access (my own spreadsheet) if it means I can rely on having a working system when times get tough for us. I would have to anyways. 

      Luckily for us, the decision to remove our reliance on YNAB isn't immediately necessary.  However, the catalyst for us was always going to be a price increase or absolute necessity.

      Like 2
      • PS
      • Maroon_Trombone.16
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Gray Captain to each their own.  I am happy with what YNAB does for me and my family.  I find great value in it.  It's worth it to me. 

      Like 1
    • Move Light Sound Life We rented calculators in my high school. Or rather... a lot of kids did. Because graphing calculators are very expensive, and you mostly only need them for a couple of math classes.

      Not that I disagree with your premise - ownership is not the same thing as renting, and allows for perpetual use in a way that renting a thing doesn't. And persistently renting requires more disposable income than buying a thing once.

      Like
    • Fuzzball Meows 🙂 We bought them, seeing as we'd need to use them all four years, sometimes in both math and science classes. I still remember the year they let us do simple operations on the calculator instead of working them out. You're right, though. They were a shock of an expense. 

      Anyways, we either passed them on to a sibling or sold them to a younger classmate. There's a good incentive to take care of things that you own. Explaining to parents why they need to replace something that you ruined was a good motivator to be responsible.

      In contrast, when I see technology get issued to students, the short lifetime of planned obsolescence might actually be longer than the devices last at the hands of those students. Often, from my perspective as a teacher, a student who damages school property does not have to pay. Last year in particular had many inventory losses.

      Ah, stories. Back to topic:

      I find more value in software that I can rely on without a subscription. 

      Like
      • Seabass
      • Seabass
      • 1 mth ago
      • 5
      • Reported - view

      PS Nobody here is denying the benefits they received using YNAB.  There is a bucket load of anger and sadness in this thread.  The issue for many is much more the deception and lack of communication by the company.  Also, many have been patiently waiting on promised improvements and features that have not materialized.  If they had lived up to the promises made to the legacy users and communicated their on going needs ($) in order to grow, then this would probably be a much different thread. 

      Like 5
    • PS until they raise the price again -- how often And by how much? 

      Like
  • I am actually offended by this.

     

    I live in a third-world country with a weak currency and much lower purchasing power than the USA client which is YNAB's focus. I bought YNAB4 on Steam and used it for years. It really helped me to develop a better mindset about my money and to get organized. It was worth every penny. Then came the "new YNAB", under the consumer-unfriendly SaaS model, and I couldn't justify downgrading to it from my YNAB4 which was already bought and paid for. Plus, at launch, it hadn't reached feature parity with YNAB4 and of course required an active Internet connection, which is not a guarantee where I live, so it was a no-brainer: continue using the superior software for free, or downgrade to the new inferior version for a very expensive renewing fee?

     

    I stayed with YNAB4 until I couldn't sync my budget with my phone anymore. The new Dropbox API was incompatible and Wi-Fi Sync for some reason also didn't work. I started my free trial of "nYNAB", now not so new anymore and almost feature-par with YNAB4 (it's still missing some of the bells and whistles). During the trial, I tried a few dozen different alternatives, from GNU Cash to EveryDollar, from Mint to Quicken and the only solution that came close to YNAB for me was Aspire. I'm a university student, so I extended my free trial to a year, made a category for buying a yearly subscription and went on using YNAB and Aspire Budget in parallel. I'm sorry to say that I still preferred YNAB. I managed to convince myself that 84 dollars a year wasn't much compared to the amount it helped me to save in the long run. 

     

    Now, before even having the opportunity to pay for my first annual subscription (and halfway through saving for it), I have to deal with a price increase that may not be much for your customers in the USA, but which is worth two weeks of groceries for me. My budget isn't large, every penny counts. And what benefits do I get in exchange? Features I can't use. Syncing to banks that are not in my country, an Android app that lags far behind the iPhone app in features, pointless busywork like changing "available to budget" to "available to assign" (who cares?)... and still no attempt to make the budget accessible offline for people with connection problems. So it's getting hard to justify the continued payment of this 84 dollar subscription, as I'm just continuing to pay for features that were already there months ago, but an INCREASE? For what? Just because the work you did months ago put your product... sorry, your service... head and shoulders above the rest, you now get to rest on your laurels, do only busywork and charge whatever you please for it and people will acquiesce? Well, this is me not acquiescing.

     

    I guess it's back to trying a million different alternatives, starting with Aspire. As soon as I can leave YNAB, I will. I know that none of you care if you lose one customer here, another there, and maybe that's at the core of the problem. YNAB was always friendly, open, with an excellent community and great PR. Now, you've become just another faceless company putting profits before the needs of their customers. I am insulted and I am disappointed. YNAB is a good product. I wish I could stay. But the choice was made for me with this price hike.

    Like 16
    • Navy Blue Network Looks like Aspire has not had any activity for over a year.

      Like
    • Saish Dawg Really? Well, isn't that just great? Do you know of any other options that come close to YNAB in terms of features and workflow? Maybe something that became popular recently?

       

      Financier.io, which was a pretty good YNAB4 clone, is dead for a long time, the Play Store is filled with sketchy apps that I wouldn't trust with how much change is in my pockets, much less how much money I have in the bank... It's hard to find something good. But Aspire is "just" a spreadsheet, right? Can't I just make an offline copy for myself, or does it connect to some backend that might need to be maintained?

      Like
      • Jakub
      • Jakub
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Navy Blue Network Have a look at PocketSmith. It's a bit different from YNAB, but in the end provides a lot more, for reasonable price.

      Like
    • Jakub PocketSmith, to be useful, is just about as expensive.  I used it before YNAB.  It is the epitome of forecasting in lieu of budgeting (and they advertise the former prominently everywhere).  I'm revisiting it after a few happy years here with YNAB.

      Like
      • Jakub
      • Jakub
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg You are right, of course. My bad! I did not even notice the yearly price as I am still using quarterly payments in case I decide to stop using it. But in any case, I still believe there is lot more functionality for the same price (bank imports!). Even though the approach is a bit different from YNAB.

      Like
    • Saish Dawg That doesn’t mean it doesn’t work. As it stands, it is fully functional in the latest version.

      Like
    • Tomato Grizzly Totally true.  Equally, if anything is broken, the likelihood of a fix is far lower if the last update is a while ago.  YMMV.

      Like
  • So does anyone have a spreadsheet with formulas inserted similar to a rudimentary YNAB system?? *Asking for a friend ;) 

    Like 2
      • Hannah
      • Account Manager
      • hannahsbudget
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Gironaso same 😂

      Like
    • Gironaso Making an envelope-style budget template in a spreadsheet is really easy. The trick is to integrate the account registers so that the budget categories update. Another layer would be the credit card handling. I'm thinking a month-end or reconcilation process that closes out a worksheet might help keep it clean. 

      Supposedly, there's a template floating around on the internet somewhere.

      I'll have to stop following the drama here and actually do something, though. I kept an eye on this thread because I kept thinking there would be an official response, or at least a reason for the price hike. 

      Gotta move on, though. 

      Like 5
      • Hannah
      • Account Manager
      • hannahsbudget
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Move Light Sound Life Gironaso I just found this which seems like a possibly good option https://aspirebudget.com/ (Aspire Budget)

      Like 2
      • kooky
      • Data Analyst
      • kooky
      • 1 mth ago
      • 10
      • Reported - view

      Gironaso I managed to find a copy of the original YNAB excel sheet.

      Like 10
      • Annieland
      • I was told there would be no math.
      • Annieland
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Navy Blue Inspector That is so cool!  I think I signed up a couple of years after they migrated from the spreadsheet and I was always so curious about it.  Thanks!!

      Like 1
      • kooky
      • Data Analyst
      • kooky
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Annieland No worries! It's also still possible to get YNAB 4 if you're interested.

      Like
    • kooky This is cool!

      Like 1
    • kooky woah, so cool! Always wondered what that looked like!

      Like 1
      • Max
      • YNAB Class of 2007
      • Max
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      kooky I just uploaded this to Google Sheets and it converted perfectly.

      Like 1
    • Hannah I've just fired off an email to YNAB about why I'm quitting (written in good faith, so hopefully it will be read that way by them). I've started looking at alternatives - for a while I had my own spreadsheet. Honestly, YNAB is better than that, but not to the extent that it doesn't work.

      I'm going to take a look at Aspire as well. It looks like its not been updated for a little while, but if it works, it works.

      Like 1
      • Saish Dawg
      • saish_dawg
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Cadet Blue Door Check out Buxfer.  Have been moderately impressed.  Still envelope based but more features.

      Like 2
    • Saish Dawg anyone looked at Actual?

      Like
      • Bruce
      • Software Engineer
      • Bruce
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Turquoise Piano I'm looking at it.  It seems like it has potential.  Haven't done much with it yet, just setting it up.

      Like
    • Turquoise Piano I did.  Seems very minimalistic.  That might appeal to some folks.  Out of everything I tried (and believe I did nearly try them all), Mvelopes is the leading contender.  The main blocker for me is manual entry.  Nearly all of them seem to think this is anathema, and why wouldn't I want everything coming in automatically?  Buxter was really close but can't reconcile.  Really?  Tiller looks promising and allows total control but requires plugins to split transactions and have manual entry.  Banktivity looks great, but the envelope system is hacky, and their UI is heavyweight with lots of clicks to enter simple transactions.  Ah well, I'm still good until May here.  Will hope the state of the art (or the policies here) evolve.

      Like
      • Bruce
      • Software Engineer
      • Bruce
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg I came here from Mvelopes initially.  At the time, they had a disastrous upgrade that I was just done with, so left.  I'm seriously considering returning.  I think I should even still have my lifetime membership that I purchased.  They've had 3 years to clean up, and improve, so I'm giving them a try. (Let's see if they work faster than YNAB at adding new functionality) I think one of my favorite features when I was with them was the "sweep" feature, where you could just move all the money from selected categories into another category in one fell swoop.  So nice!

      Like 1
    • Bruce Let me know how the state of the art is.  Mvelopes is one of the only ones I did not actually sign up for myself to test.  As others have noted, Atual seems to have potential also.  

      Like
      • Superbone
      • YNAB convert since 2008
      • Superbone
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Bruce Yes, please fill us in on the state of Mvelopes.

      Like
    • Turquoise Piano Yep. It is what I have settled on. It's $48/yr essentially the same as the $50/yr I was paying for YNAB. I duplicated my accounts and budget, it came out exactly as YNAB calculates. Has most of the main features. No direct import, goals, no much for reports, and some others that I'm not that concerned with. I just want to track my budget, I never looked much at reports or set much for goals. Which is why the price increase doesn't reflect the features I use.

      Like 2
    • Steel Blue Griffin Goals, direct import, the reports and  loan stuff in YNAB didn't tick the boxes for me either so while Actual comes across as a bit dull, it's not bloated and it's very clean and does the job - you can tell whoever built it has done it with high quality (and probably was a YNAB user). 

      When you think about it the best feature of YNAB is clean transaction adding and the ledger/zero-based budget allocated by what's available. This is not rocket science. So in some ways I'm glad they put the pricing up because now I can go find something much cheaper. 

      Like 1
    • Bruce let us know how you get on!

      Like
    • Turquoise Piano Agreed. I wasn't a big user of those YNAB options and Actual is exactly as you describe. It is clean and fast and I've found zero bugs or issues, it does seem high quality. The features that exist have all worked perfectly so far for me, which is a good sign of quality.

      Absolutely true. Goals, direct import, reports, etc may be nice to have. But at the end of day I just want something to keep track of transactions and monthly envelope budgeting, and Actual seems to do that. Mvelopes looks interesting, though the basic plan is still $69/yr, not sure what that offers over Actual other than maybe direct import.

      Like 2
    • Steel Blue Griffin I'm trying to check out mvelopes but I keep getting a security error which is not at my end...

      Like
    • Turquoise Piano  I got the same problem...   I'm in Argentina...   Not sure if that's the problem...  Quicken does not sell outside US & Canada, not sure the reasons...   Probably the same situation of being outside US?

      Like
    • Turquoise Interesting. Not a good start for new software. I'd like to hear opinions. I'm not a fan of trials that require a credit card upfront, so likely will not be testing.

      Like
      • Bruce
      • Software Engineer
      • Bruce
      • 4 wk ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Steel Blue Griffin Superbone Saish Dawg

      So, I've been playing around with Mvelopes, and am less inclined to use it the more I look.  Here's a couple of things I came up against, that I don't like.

      1.)    You can only have one budget.    Everything comes in, and it all goes into the categories (envelopes) that you have.  But you can't (at least I haven't found a way to) do a test budget to see how certain scenarios will work.

      1.a.)    Which means I can't really have my kids budgets on here any more.  Unless I just put their bank accounts in with mine, and intermingle their money with mine.  I'd have to have a category group for son #1, and another category group for son #2.  Don't think I want to do that.

      2.)    I haven't found a way to edit categories in the mobile app.  Or, let me rephrase that.  I found the edit button, and I changed the name, and saved it.  Then I went back to the list of categories and the name hadn't changed.  It works on the web app, but not on mobile.

      3.)    The "income" portion of the budget has no connection to reality.  You manually put in (on the "income" tab of the "planning" section) your various income sources, and how much/how often it is.  These numbers are then used on the Budget to indicate if your budget is balanced or not.  But if you got fewer hours or extra bonus, you have to manually edit the income portion.  Also there's "Monthly Funding Plan" and "Budget" tab  that just lets you put numbers in.  not really any enforcement of "zero balance".   (there's a footer which is easily overlooked that indicates if you're over or under budget)

      4.) I'm not sure how easily INM workflow could be implemented.  If you click on "unallocated money" it brings you to a screen where you can allocate into categories, but if you want to use the "funding plan" you can't do that based on unallocated, only on the income that you manually entered.

      On the Positive side:

      1.)    The account auto import works quite well.
      2.)    There is a "debt center" where you can see your debts and play with scenarios of pay off dates.
      3.)    In the mobile app, you can sort envelopes by highest to lowest amount, low to high, or by group.
      4.)    The "sweep" function is AWESOME.  Where you can move from or to multiple envelopes at once, and select a specific envelope to hold the "overflow"
      5.) You can (fairly easily) transfer between 2 envelopes but not quite as easily as nYNAB.
       

      I started trying to replicate my categories/groups from nYNAB, but haven't finished, and don't think I'm going to at this point.  Even though it's free to me, since I previously had the lifetime membership, I just don't see it being something I'll enjoy using long term.

      Hope this was somewhat helpful, there are some really nice things about it, but some of the bad kinda annoy me enough that I'm probably moving on to something else.  Actual, BudgetWise, and CountAbout are 3 that I'm considering.  Budget with Buckets is a distant 4th.  Maybe if they get reconciliation going it would be worth another look.

      ETA: There really isn't such a thing as "goals", just a funding plan.  But it doesn't automatically adjust if you put more or less in on a given month.

      Like 2
    • Bruce 

      Thanks for that detailed write up.  I have signed up over at Actual.  However, there are two deal breakers for me, for now.   Let the developer know, and he was responsive earlier.

       

      * Security is not there yet.  Just put your email in and get a PIN.  Not even a password, to say nothing of 2FA.  So, not trusting anything there (though they do offer end-to-end encryption, but really the devils are in the details there).

       

      * Scheduled transactions lack categories.   So there is no way to really even budget in month with those transactions.  

       

      I really, really want to love Buxter, but the lack of any ability to reconcile transactions is also fatal for that app.  Wrote both sets of developers and will see.  FWIW, it really does appear Actual has only one (or a handful) of developers.  All the commits, release notes and email replies are from the same James.  Though he is responsive.

      Like
      • Habanero Salsa
      • Second generation user
      • Aquamarine_Pony.8
      • 4 wk ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg I like what’s there of Actual but, frankly, it’s at more of the “proof of concept” stage than the “released software” stage. 
       

      I’ve mirrored by YNAB budget and it mostly works fine for what’s in place already. One funky thing is that it apparently won’t let me have a payee name the same as an account name. I have an Apple Card and have Apple as a payee. In YNAB, “Apple” works for both. 
       

      Of the ones I’ve tried, this one holds the most promise of being what I want. And being able to turn the arrow right to handle reimbursements was glorious. 

      Like 2
      • Bruce
      • Software Engineer
      • Bruce
      • 4 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg Yeah, I'm hearing everybody's crazy over Actual.  I'm giving it a run now, and it technically "reconciles" but it doesn't lock the transaction.  Which means you can change the transaction amount after it's been reconciled.  I won't use it if it does that.  But still testing it for other things.

      I'm not in love with it, but I'm giving it a chance.  It's only been a couple of days.

      Like
    • Bruce Habanero Salsa

      I'm willing to keep working with their developer, and I'm sure he is inundated with YNAB migratory feedback.  Just on my own end, nothing ticks every box yet, and in May I will be totally debt free.  Ironically, my subscription here ends then.  Seems like fate or kizmit.  So, will keep posting and researching until then.  

      Like 2
      • Habanero Salsa
      • Second generation user
      • Aquamarine_Pony.8
      • 4 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg Yeah, like I said, it holds the most promise. I’m just saying it’s polished about as much as I’d expect from something that’s version 0.0.xxx.

       

      I watched the guy on twitch.tv. The app matters to him and he’s put a lot of thought into the infrastructure. UI stuff and changes/bug fixes based on users’ input should be expected. This is as golden a business opportunity as he could have wished for. I doubt lack of effort will be a problem.

      Like
    • Bruce  In YNAB you can change the transaction amount after reconciling as well as delete it. It however will give you a warning. 

      Like 2
    • Bruce Why would you adjust a past transaction value if you've reconciled? 

      Like 1
    • Saish Dawg I tried Buxter and wanted to like it because it had zero based and a bunch of wealth building features but it's a mess. The 'tags' category system is really unfriendly to use. The UI feels quite dated. 

      Like
      • Bruce
      • Software Engineer
      • Bruce
      • 4 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Navy Blue Disk Turquoise Piano 

      Navy Blue Disk said:
      In YNAB you can change the transaction amount after reconciling as well as delete it. It however will give you a warning. 

       Yes, I know.  And that warning is what's missing  in the other app.  It doesn't care if it's reconciled or not.  Just lets you change it.  So what's the point of calling it reconciled if you can change it afterwards?

      Turquoise Piano said:
      Why would you adjust a past transaction value if you've reconciled? 

       You shouldn't.  That's the point.  But if you want to test if something works right, you test against things that shouldn't happen and see what it does.  There is no warning that the transaction has been reconciled, and it will change it.  That's a problem.

      Like
      • Seabass
      • Seabass
      • 4 wk ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Bruce The only person that would change it would be you and why would you unless something is amiss?  The system would not warn you that it changed it.  So why would you need a warning if you wish/need to change it?  Seems an odd thing to be important or a deal breaker.  I personally have never had a need to change a reconciled item and so had no idea there was a warning attached to that action.

      Like 2
    • Seabass I agree. It's very picky.

      Like 1
    • Habanero Salsa All great to hear!  Thanks for the links.

      Like
    • Turquoise Piano Yeah, really wanted to like it, but like you said, there is just not enough there, there.

      Like
      • Bruce
      • Software Engineer
      • Bruce
      • 4 wk ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Seabass Turquoise Piano 

      Ok, there are only 2 states for a transaction right now in Actual Budget.  uncleared and cleared.  There's no way to indicate that the transaction was reconciled (as indicated by a lock icon in nYNAB)  

      Perhaps I wasn't clear enough, although if you look ahead, I did mention it but obviously not in a way that made sense.  So, would you agree that at some times there might possibly be a reason to adjust a cleared transaction?  Perhaps you don't make mistakes in your budget, but I have.  And I've needed to adjust a transaction that was marked as cleared.

      Well, there's no difference in Actual between "cleared" and "reconciled".  In fact, when you hit "reconcile" just the simple fact of clearing the transactions is what it considers it to be reconciled.  There's no "lock" and you can "unclear" the transaction or change its value after it's been "reconciled" because that word has no real meaning other than "cleared" in Actual.

      I hope that makes more sense.  I don't feel I'm being "picky".  I just don't like the fact that I could accidentally unclear or modify a "reconciled" transaction and have it completely mess up my reconciliation history.

      Like 1
      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 4 wk ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Seabass 

      Seabass said:
      The only person that would change it would be you and why would you unless something is amiss? 

       There is always the risk of changing something accidentally. So if a transaction has been reconciled, you want a warning of that.

      Secondly, there's always the possibility of a messed up reconciliation due to human error and fixing an already reconciled transaction that has incorrect data may be useful. But because it's reconciled you don't want the system to just accept the changes blindly because it may in fact have been an accidental change.

      Like 1
      • Habanero Salsa
      • Second generation user
      • Aquamarine_Pony.8
      • 4 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Bruce I agree completely that reconciliation needs to be more robust (like a few things with that app). That said, implementing those kinds of things is relatively trivial with the infrastructure already in place.

      I really like that it’s an actual database and not a gigantic XML file or whatever. Actual definitely needs polish,  tu that’s the easy part. Additionally, though the guy has a plan, he seems more than willing to listen to people. Unlike some personal budgeting companies. 

      Like
      • Seabass
      • Seabass
      • 4 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      nolesrule  In all fairness to me, I did say unless something is amiss. In all the years working as a Senior Accountant and using YNAB for my personal budget, I have never had to correct a reconciled transaction. I have had to make unexpected adjustments in a closed quarter at work, but again not on a reconciled item. For me, I don’t hit that button lightly. I make absolutely sure it is accurate to the penny.  As people more over to other products, they will not find all the features or things just like YNAB and my point was that one thing should not be a deal breaker.

      Like
      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 4 wk ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Seabass 

      Seabass said:
      In all the years working as a Senior Accountant and using YNAB for my personal budget, I have never had to correct a reconciled transaction.

       Neither have I. But just because you and I are perfect doesn't mean other people don't make mistakes. 🤣

      Like 1
      • pgauntlett
      • pgauntlett
      • 11 days ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg I have my scheduled transactions set up in Actual with both categories and notes. They have been posting perfectly. As you have probably  found out you can save the scheduled transaction and then go back in an select “edit as a rule” and add whatever you like. I think the developers original logic was that you would not need to specify the category in the schedule as the payee would already have a category assigned to it through the separate payee rules function.

      Like 1
      • Saish Dawg
      • saish_dawg
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      pgauntlett Seems a bit clunkier.  Though doable, as it is only a one-time setup.  Does that work for manual transactions as well?  Meaning you set up a scheduled one, and on the date it is due you can "accept" it without having a direct import come in instead?

      Like
      • pgauntlett
      • pgauntlett
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Saish Dawg  yes you can either set the scheduled transaction to “auto post” OR if you didn’t  choose the auto post option in set up then  just select the upcoming transaction  (in account register view) and post  (or skip)  it yourself 

      Like
      • Saish Dawg
      • saish_dawg
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      pgauntlett Okay.  Very cool.  I still have a few months in my subscription, so will wait and watch how things develop over at Actual.  Please keep posting as things improve!  And thanks.

      Like
  • After  a day's reflection - my position hasn't changed.

    YNAB's zero based budgeting system simply isn't sufficient, on its own, to justify the price being asked, with one exception:  If you're in financial distress and need to dig yourself out (Dave Ramsey's "debt snowball" concept).  For that, its invaluable, and it's cheaper than Ramsey's Everydollar Plus (the next best alternative)

    If you've established proper spending hygiene, and are confident you've integrated the 4 principles into your financial 'operating system', YNAB is inadequate.  You have financial stability.  What you need at that point are addtional features to track and manage wealthbuilding.

    YNAB doesn't speak to that, and its not on their roadmap..  But they're now charging more than tools like Quicken Premier and Monarch Money that do offer  those capabilities, and which can be adapted  with some hacking to zero based budgets. (Frankly, its shocking Quicken doesn't understand the opportunity here.  If they implemented zero based budgeting as an option, they'd crush most of the competition)

    YNAB gets you through financial puberty.  You need more to get to full financial adulthood.

    Like 27
      • Superbone
      • YNAB convert since 2008
      • Superbone
      • 1 mth ago
      • 9
      • Reported - view

      WhoMovedMyCheese Well said. This is where I'm at as well. I appreciate YNAB for being the largest reason for my financial turnaround. Before YNAB, I had never learned to budget properly. But, alas, time moves on and things change. I continued to subscribe at $45 because of that history. I continued to hang around and offer advice to newbies. I feel like I was giving more than I was receiving. Time to move on to full-featured financial software.

      Like 9
      • Superbone
      • YNAB convert since 2008
      • Superbone
      • 1 mth ago
      • 23
      • Reported - view

      Putting my money where my mouth is:

      Like 23
    • Superbone  Good for you (ETA: “good” in the bittersweet sense, ofc). I remember you back in the “old forums,”and a few other familiar names/avatars posting in this thread, too.  Everyone was so insightful and really shaped my YNAB usage AND then-lacking financial perspective. Early on, I helped (administratively, not development) manage nYNAB Toolkit requests from forum users way before even switching myself because I really wanted it to succeed! I’m back to the “new forums” for the first time in 5ish years to follow the convo and it’s weird to return to my start to see us all breakup from YNAB (or…vice versa). Anywho, thanks for letting me reminisce :) 

      Like 2
    • stephywephy Yep. I was there. While the switch to nYNAB was rough and crappy, many like us stuck it through. This really does feel like the end though. If not of the whole thing, then at least the old guard. I can't quantify my disappointment at the people who run this ship.

      Like 2
    • Superbone Yep, I've done the same. I won't pretend I've been active in the forums (at all) but I can understand why its frustrating for you. Having been pointed towards the delete account option and requesting a refund, thats exactly what I've done. I don't want to be all "waaah woe is me" but its just a bit of a let down, frankly.

      The move to the SaaS model, which I can understand, if not fully support, was a big increase in costs for all existing users. There's no ifs or buts - it was a big increase. 

      To then put out a higher price point for newer customers is one thing, I guess. But to then massively increase the price for older users for what is, functionally, pretty much the same thing is kinda rude.

      If they get enough customers at the higher price, then good for them. But having seen two very large increases in their pricing I would fully expect another. As this has been announced without really giving a proper reason as to what that increase represents other than increased revenue, I simply cannot justify paying it.

      I sort of even feel bad for writing this here, on their forums, using their own webspace to share this... but I'm just really quite disappointed. YNAB has long been a product that I had faith in, but the reality is I don't want to be someone who flings money at a business just because they ask for it. I've had a rough couple of years and coming through the other side, my finances was one thing I wanted to put right. My first choice was YNAB, what I had always used previously, but I guess its time to find something more affordable.

      So long, as they say, and thanks for all the fish.

      Like 6
    • Superbone Mine is cancelled too, but my message was longer than yours!

      Like 1
  • What is the plan going forward to make YNAB worth this dramatic price increase? How is the company going to offset the number of current subscribers that will fall off their subscriber list because they no longer see the value of spending that amount of money on an app? I already hate subscription models, an increase of this nature needs more backing to validate it. Financial reports or proposed project costs that users MIGHT see a benefit in would be a good start. I'm guessing there will be many looking into the yearly financial reports of YNAB this year to see if this increase is needed, if the company themselves has fallen into poor financial habits, or if it is just a push for a higher profit margin at the expense of their subscribers.

    Like 3
  • I used YNAB 4 as long as it worked with my phone, but eventually I had to switch to new YNAB with full of new features I don't care too much (I live in Hungary so link to banks is not working me either). I missing some features from YNAB4, but I can live with that new version of YNAB. I have been granted with 10% lifetime discount, but not the 45USD/year price as I skipped the limited time offer and used YNAB4 as long as I could. I could still justify the price, when I had to switch to the new software as a service model, but now I'm thinking about going back to YNAB4 on my PC without phone sync for free. I think the price should be cheaper and cheaper (and not the opposite) as more and more people pay the subscription fee based on SaaS model. And I am sorry to say but I could not refer this app to my friends anymore at this price point.

    Like 3
  • The scale of this price raise is absolutely outrageous. I’ve been a YNAB customer since 2015, and an enthusiastic advocate for the app, the website and blog posts that support it, and the community that surrounds it, both here on the forums and elsewhere online like on Reddit. It’s something I use almost daily, and it’s been incredibly helpful in helping me a) actively make a useable budget and b) stick to it and save money at the same time. 
     

    But changing my annual cost from $45 to $89?! This is a ludicrously large jump! Literally doubling the cost of the service! This is unjustifiable.

     

    I understand the need to increase subscription costs if the cost of providing the service has also increased. I would understand and support a proportional and incremental increase to account for this. But I absolutely cannot accept the cost to be literally doubled from one year to the next.
     

    You must know the impact this will have on your customers, who are literally here to budget and manage their money, to drop this kind of bombshell and make the careful planning we’ve been doing in order to set the right amount of money aside each month to cover annual charges?! This price increase makes a mockery of the service you’re trying to provide!

     

    Another thing I hadn’t budgeted for: time to research and select a replacement budgeting app! I’m very reluctant to do this and leave YNAB, for all of the benefits I’ve got out of using it for the past 6 years… but this is a total slap in the face to your long-standing and committed customers and supporters, and makes me not want to support your company and app anymore. 
     

    I hope you get enough negative feedback from this that you’ll reconsider this totally customer-hostile price-gouging money-grab opportunity you’re taking, and will come back with a more reasonable suggestion for how you’re going to increase prices in a more humane way to the customers who have supported you for the longest. Doubling the cost of a service (especially one aimed at helping to manage budget!) over any period of time is going to be a hard pill to swallow and one I’m not sure I want to take, but if you’re insistent upon throwing the legacy pricing out of the window for us and aligning everybody on the objectively high cost you’re now asking, the least you could do is design a gradual year-by-year increase over a number of years to enable us to budget accordingly.

    Like 10
    • Emmavescence I am going back to ynab 4.... I also have the $45 fee... been with them since ynab3 (right before 4)

      Like 1
  • Something definitely doesn't feel right....   A message via the mobile app 1 month before a nearly 100% price change for your most loyal customers/advocates, with literally NO justification for the increase outside of "we're committed to making your budget better and better" ?    So rushed that the billing section of the Web app hasn't even been updated?!   

    I think it's time for the communication that should have been presented in the first place...

    - What is the justification for the sudden and drastic price change?  To keep the lights on ? Unforeseen expense? Ramp up revenue before sale?  To drastically improve the app?  How?

    A large price change is one thing, but one done last minute without literally any justification communicated really doesn't sit well.   I had no reason to look for YNAB alternatives last week, now it seems to be on the list for '22, which is sad.

    Like 10
  • Does anyone know who is actually running YNAB now? This craziness makes me think perhaps they got a cash injection from some private equity firm that took a controlling stake in the company or something. I saw another commenter say that Jesse isn’t CEO anymore, but don’t see anything on their site about a change in leadership. Is Jesse gone or something? 

    Like 2
      • kooky
      • Data Analyst
      • kooky
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Matt You can look it up on LinkedIn. Todd Curtis has been CEO since Feb 2021.

      Like 1
      • Matt
      • Forest_Green_Transistor.13
      • 1 mth ago
      • 9
      • Reported - view

      kooky thanks for that detail! No idea who he is, but I guess he has a radically different view of how to run the company than Jesse did! Too bad since this was by far my favorite app ever. Now I don’t think I can trust them after being lied to regarding our pricing, receiving no acceptable communication other than a pop up message in the app, having a 2x price increase overnight, and the company going radio silent rather than any reasonable explanation for attempting such a bizarre thing that alienates their most ardent long term supporters. 

      Like 9
      • Saish Dawg
      • saish_dawg
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Matt Guessing Jesse left, got his (well deserved) payout, and we have a new chief in charge who has far different priorities and is likely looking for his own payout later.

      Like 1
      • kooky
      • Data Analyst
      • kooky
      • 1 mth ago
      • 4
      • Reported - view

      Matt Yeah, I would've expected something at least by now. Even a "we're working on it" or a "we're re-evaluating things. 

      Like 4
      • Orchid Python
      • YNAB since 2005
      • Orchid_Python.9
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      kooky I didn't realise this - we'll that's my loyalty out the window, and also explains why Jesse hasn't mentioned any of this on his podcasts that I've listened too

      Like
      • jake
      • jake
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Matt They’ve covered this on the podcast (can’t remember if it was YNAB or Beginning Balance). Jesse is still the owner (or co-owner with the CTO) but stepped back from CEO duties. This sounds like a pretty straightforward price adjustment that went sideways.

      Like 1
      • Matt
      • Forest_Green_Transistor.13
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      jake very interesting... I wouldn't consider a 2x price increase on your oldest customer base to be straight forward. :) If a relatively new CEO did that to a company I owned it would definitely be a WTF moment followed up by a very serious discussion about judgement and how to quickly correct the issue before more damage is done from letting it sit. Not my company though. ;)

      Like 2
      • jake
      • jake
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Matt I think it’s easy to get caught up in the excitement of this thread. The business reality is that if fewer than half the early adopters cancel, the company comes out way ahead. That’s definitely the sort of thinking I’d want from my CEO. They take a hit on goodwill but I think the participants of this forum don’t have a good sense of just how much the company’s subscriber base has grown over the past several years and how small the early adopter population is. Last I heard they have about 130 staff – think about how many subscriptions that represents.

      Like 1
      • Habanero Salsa
      • Second generation user
      • Aquamarine_Pony.8
      • 1 mth ago
      • 9
      • Reported - view

      jake If the early adopter population is that small, screwing them makes even less sense. 

      Like 9
      • Budget_NC
      • Tomato_Snow_237e7f17927
      • 1 mth ago
      • 5
      • Reported - view

      Habanero Salsa There's truth in that.  The early adopters are the most faithful and most knowledgeable of the product.  In many ways they are an extended part of the support staff.  How many questions has Superbone answered for customers over the years?  And cancelled today.

      Like 5
      • Seabass
      • Seabass
      • 1 mth ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      jake Yes, and tobacco didn’t cause cancer and nicotine wasn’t addictive.  Hooray for capitalism and lying to your customers. My main point is this should have been handled much better. They could have chosen to treat their customers with much more respect and consideration and still increase the prices. And they could have given everyone a much longer and more professional notice.  I certainly hope you would not want your CEO to treat your customers this way.

      Like 2
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