Open Banking for direct banking in the UK

Hi

Now that the UK has started Open Banking , does YNAB have any plans to support it?

Yolt is already making great strides here, and I anticipate that there will be a flurry of similar apps/services.

Thanks

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  • Agreed - I hardly use cash, but am sometimes forced to (taxis, barbers, restaurant tips etc) to be able to only ever use my card or phone.

    have only just stated looking through Moneyhub, but can’t see how one accounts for cash or budgets in advance for known upcoming expenditures (I guess this is evenvelope stuffing?)

    Like
      • Gray Tape
      • Gray_Tape
      • 10 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      twhh 

      I use moneyhub now. For anything that's not monthly I put it in the forecast for the relevant month and its worked well for me so far. I only track food with a monthly budget feature other than that as most other things are fairly stable monthly outgoings and show in the forecast. If not, they are what they are, and I minimise the spend to essentials. 

      Would be handy to have envelopes too, but I'm finding I can manage without and I love the forecasting feature. I had asked ynab before about forecasting but got fobbed off as usual. 

      Like
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 10 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Gray Tape How do you manage/account for cash expenditure?

      I need to do some digging around on forecasts... for example, I can't quite see how I account for a £300 car service that'l be due in April.

      Like
      • Gray Tape
      • Gray_Tape
      • 10 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      twhh 

      I haven't tackled the cash expenditure in moneyhub.  Mine is all going to cash spend.  Although, I guess I could categorise the withdrawal as a transfer and then maintain a manual Cash account, categorising individual spend from there.  I used to do this in ynab, but just been a bit lazy with the new app. 

      For the car service, I've entered them in the relevant month of the year in the forecast. I can see if I have cash flow problems ahead then as the forecast accounts for average monthly inflow / outflow as well. I made sure the monthly figures didn't include any annual costs. So for cars, ave fuel in the monthly figures, but service, MOT, tax in the relevant month for the forecast. It doesn't set the money aside, just shows if you going to hit any cash flow problems.  I can also add upcoming irregular income this way, to get a more realistic outlook. 

      Think it took a month of figures to generate the forecast so may have to trial it. 

      Pros and cons to both ynab and moneyhub but I felt I couldn't deal with the lack of ynab support for open banking in the end. 

      Good luck

      Like
      • D. A.
      • Senior Technical Program Manager
      • D_A
      • 10 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      twhh Yeah, I think that's the one (and only) place where the other tools don't do as good a job as YNAB - they appear to think that no-one cares about cash any longer. Whilst I barely use cash, there are always some places you're going to have to use it. I tried setting up a cash account as an offline source in MoneyDashboard, but you can't tell it that an ATM withdrawal from the current account is actually a transfer to the cash account. Seems to be similar with Moneyhub.

      Still not a big enough hassle to make me want to stay with YNAB though.

      Like
  • I'm categorising cash accordingly to the relevant category, if for example I withdraw for a specific purpose such as haircuts or paying someone. And I've got general spending category for when I want to carry a small bit around with me. Fortunately for me cash is no big deal as it's  relatively small amounts these days.  

    Like
  • Everyone,

     

    Thanks to the folks recommending MoneyHub here.

    I'm now using MoneyHub to get all my UK bank accounts into one place and then I manually export the transactions and load them into YNAB about 1 / week.

    With the account names matching exactly between both services the manual import takes about 2 minutes to import and reconcile ~ 10 accounts.

    Moneyhub costs 1 pound per month or 10 pound per year so it's not too crazy on top of the YNAB costs.

    I've also tried Sync for YNAB but it's more pricey and they don't support as many UK banks.

    It would still be great for YNAB to push direct imports from UK banks, but at least this way I don't have to give up YNAB just yet.

     

    Hope this helps someone.

     

    Best,
    Seb

    Like
  • YNAB really need to listen here. Customers in the UK will expect YNAB to support Open Banking. No other option will be acceptable. It sounds as though there are new apps appearing regularly that support Open Banking, and YNAB won’t be able to complete if it doesn’t support it or charges extra to support it. 

     

    I would assume that the api would allow YNAB to support open banking without needing to involve a third party. That’s what open banking is far - and to avoid the ridiculous situation of expecting people to give bank login details to a third party - which is utterly unacceptable. 

    Like 2
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 8 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Beige Drill the problem is, the open banking APIs 1) require a lot of regulation work to be able to access them, 2) are super unreliable. 

      It's not as simple as just adding support for them. You have to then have people maintain them when they break etc. 

      Like 1
    • Scott Robertson 

      A little frustrated that this request is gone nowhere in over a year and would like to add support.

      Also, I think you need to justify comments about the open banking API.

      This is a UK government supported interface that is approved by them for use by all UK based financial institutes for sharing banking data with applications such as YNAB. 

      It's a single API for the whole UK (four countries) plus in time I suspect several dependents territories. 

      If you are saying it's not fit for purpose that's a serious comment especially when there are 100's if not 1000's of existing users.

      If you're saying it breaks a lot again that a serious suggestion as given the parties involved in setting it up

      Like
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 8 mths ago
      • 3
      • Reported - view

      Cadet Blue Lobster I run Sync for YNAB, and interact with the API's every single day. They are super unreliable. For example, at the time of writing the comment the other day, the Barclays oAuth url had been down for 3 days, preventing anyone connecting at all.

      What Open Banking is good at is marketing. Your comment shows that.

      It's not a single API. It's an API spec, implemented by each bank. Each having their own issues, hosted on their own servers etc.

      Another example: Nationwide like to randomly disconnect  accounts at 8am on random days.

      My point is that this is not as easy as Open Banking make it. And that is before you consider any legal stuff.

      Like 3
    • Scott Robertson Thank you for adding in those details! I'm sorry Sync with YNAB has trouble, as well! Our Direct Import partner hasn't taken on the Open Banking API, and I believe the obstacles you mentioned are why. They hope to be able to expand at some point, but they're having trouble tackling integrations internationally. 

      Like
      • Cyan Boat
      • Cyan_Boat.1
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Scott Robertson You're talking about the old banks, I'm with one of the new banks starling and their API is brilliant. No issues and never disconnects.

      Like
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 8 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Cyan Boat Sure, they are awesome. But for YNAB to add support for a single bank directly, they still have to go through all the regulatory steps in the UK. That is a lot of work for what is going to essentially be a few hundred customers.

      This stuff is not as black and white as people seem to think it is.

      Like 1
    • Scott Robertson They wont tell us how many UK customers they have so not sure how you know its a few hundred. If that was the case they could have said that and I think people will then accept it. If they have a few thousand, more likely, then it looks like they dont care about a large customer base and that probably why they arent providing numbers.

      Secondly, I dont think your comments are unbiased; With your responses it sounds like you are trying to discourage YNAB from implementing this because this will put you out of business and impact your profits.

      Like
      • Tomato Colt
      • Tomato_Colt.1
      • 8 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Turquoise Cyborg Hi I think Scott Robertson meant a few hundred customers of YNAB UK who are with Starling Bank not  in total.   Businesses are there to make profit  - very few actually "care" about their customers.  If YNAB has decided that it doesn't add up commercially to invest in providing Direct Import for Non US Banks it's a huge shame; I'd love them to.  Ultimately as a customer we can decide if it is a priority for us and if it is just take our business elsewhere. Faness  Please keep us top to date with the roadmap.

      Like 1
  • Starling bank for example already has an API which can be connected to easily. Someone has developed a free version anyone can use. I imagine the people at YNAB already know this though. A proper integration would be really nice though.

    Like
  • I've been using MoneyHub for a few months now and have today cancelled my YNAB subscription as I've not even opened the YNAB budget since switching to MoneyHub.

    Like
    • Turquoise Cyborg me too. Moved to moneyhub, never looked back. Never a problem with syncing it just works. And they're on the case making improvements. It's the future

      Like
    • Saul Annett Is there feature parity? I must say auto banking would be almost enough to jump?

      Like
    • Tetsugaku its not the same as budgeting, but you can set limit for categories and see how you track against them and how much you can spend to stay on track. It also shows you daily charts of your current spend vs same time last month which is quite nice here is a full month view but you will see the shaded/solid line during the month to see how you are tracking. The horizontal line is your budget/limit

      Like 1
    • Tetsugaku Not exactly the same which worried me at the start (but it needn't have). I'd become so accustomed to the detailed envelope budgets in ynab.

      However having used moneyhub for a few months I've found that anything lacking is made up for in other ways. For example, you can set budgets and track progress, not in the same detail and not using an envelope system. But it notifies you via push notifications as you spend and approach limits. 

      Overall my financial awareness has actually increased due to the automation and push nature of the support you get from moneyhub. It will ask me questions about my spend, let me know when I'm approaching a limit, and automatically categorise transactions (which it then asks me to verify).

      So it's not really a like for like comparison but they can serve the same purpose. If you want to keep track of spending, be financially aware, set budgets, then moneyhub has that. Overall for me it wins due to the automation, direct importing, more intuitive and intelligent features. If you're after envelope budgeting and you're happy with manually doing this then you may be best off with ynab. 

      Moneyhub surprised me and I suspect it would be more than enough for most people. Hope that helps... Let me know how you get on

      Like 2
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Saul Annett I had a play with the Moneyhub trial,  it got a bit scared off - not by the app itself, more how is be able to manage / plan upcoming payments, ie a membership that is charged every 3/6/12 months. I couldn’t see a way to ‘give every dollar a job’, more track actual spend as it happens.

      Am I missing something? would so like to migrate away, but I think I’m so engrained in the YNAB system that I’m currently thinking of renewing my YNAB sub (which I get at a discount as I’ve been with them for so long) and a Sync for YNAB... but I really don’t  want to as I’m restarting budgeting as my income has dropped very very considerably due to a change in career.

      Like
      • Gray Tape
      • Gray_Tape
      • 8 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      twhh 

      Hi, Moneyhub is very different to YNAB. If you are used to YNAB - you are probably on top of your average monthly budget, and use the envelopes in YNAB for accruing money for irregular, annual expenses....

      I have found the forecast feature in Moneyhub a useful substitute as I entered all my regular monthly income and expenses. I then put everything irregular in the months I expected it.  The forecast will show you if you are going to run out of money or if you are building up a reliable stash to pay off  mortgage etc.  I find it quite motivational! To me, this is an adequate substitute for the ynab functions. The benefits of automated imports in Moneyhub and cheaper subscription are big plus points. 

      If you are not used to making every penny count and new to budgeting then I can see YNAB has its place. I'm still using both in parallel, but don't plan on renewing ynab when my subscription finishes as I think moneyhub has everything I need  now. 

      Like 1
    • twhh no I don't think you're missing anything, and I empathise. Within moneyhub you can only input into the forecast regular expenses (which are monthly only) or irregular expenses (which are one off). So if you're looking for granular envelope budgeting and the trade off is worthwhile for you then ynab might be your best option. I was also worried like you, coming from the original ynab many years ago, but I've found I've adjusted to the new moneyhub way, and for me it's been a better option. I wish there was a best of both ways IE a solution that offered both detailed envelope budgeting as with ynab AND automated intelligent tracking of spending as with moneyhub, but there isn't for now, no doubt it will come... so for me  for now (and many others no doubt) I've given up on ynab and gone for the best option of the two, which has made my financial life so much easier. For you I can completely understand that you may feel differently. 

      Wish you luck

      Like 1
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Saul Annett Thanks. I'm having another poke around with MH. However, the last few months have been all over the place recently with me starting up a new business and money transferring from one account to another, then bouncing out to another. So, right now, I'm getting y head around how transfers work (especially for example  how a transfer to a friend to pay for a meal is automatically and hornet should correctly be classified).

      As much as I want YNAB to see how their community is helping people migrate away from their US product, I'd be ken to find out if there are user griups/support for MH. There doesn't appear to be a forum accessible for their site?

      Many thanks

      Like
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Saul Annett Given MH's low monthly cost I think I'm going to have a stab at re-working my YNAB categories to match MH's structure, and run both in parallel. Give a few months and see if I can adjust

      Like
    • twhh Just a tip, if you setup the payment on a browser even on iPhone its £0.99 per month but on iOS app £1.49 per month. Think its due to Apple wanting 30% of all sales through apps

      Like
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Turquoise Cyborg yes, I saw that. Will change my sub as originally did it through my iPhone.

      Think I may end up dropping YNAB sooner than I thought. Probably user error on my part,  but first impressions of the (relatively) expensive Sync for YNAB aren’t great. I don’t doubt that once it’s correctly configured it’ll be good, but initial set up for importing various accounts is, IMHO, a bit clunky .

      However, still grappling with putting money aside for irregular expenditure (car servicing, annual memberships etc) in MH 🤔

      Like
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 7 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      twhh Hey. Scott from Sync for YNAB here. I done quite a bit of work on the UX side of things with the setup flow over the last month. If you want to give it another go, and send in some specific pain points that would be awesome.

      Like
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 7 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Scott Robertson  thanks for the update. Having moved to  Starling a few weeks ago, all is set up and running smoothly - so hopefully won’t need to go back into the Sync for YNAB UI anytime soon!! 

      Like 1
  • As an Irish user who also use a bank who now supports open banking standards and api i will not be renewing next time around. Total joke that your providers are ignoring the EU market in full. 

    The European regulation known as the Payment Services Directive 2 (PSD2) requires banks across Europe to publish open APIs by September 2019 at the latest.

    Please put some more pressure on them (your partners) or i strongly suspect you will loose the majority of your European users within the next year or two to other solution.

    Like 3
  • Well +1 for Moneyhub have been with YNAB since the ynab 3 days but the lack of direct import / any will to resolve it for the UK is a bit of a killer. Have basically been paying £50 a year for something to retrospectively look at what ive spent every 6 months after a massive effort to get all the data in and categorised. I always swear keep on top of it but never do...... Moneyhub on the other hand has connected and imported, mulitple UK banks / credit cards, a couple of pensions and a mortgage and I'm bang up to date with very little effort. Have a far better view of my financial status within a couple of days of using the app.

    As stated above it's not as flexible budgeting wise as YNAB, theres no envelope system which may be a deal breaker for some. Does have spending limits and future expenses to get to the same thing..

    All in all for me is looking like a good fit, may take a little adjustment from the YNAB ways but its looking promising atm...

    Like
  • YNAB up for renewal
    Is there a TLDR on YNAB UK banking support coming soon or is it time to give up waiting and go for MoneyHub

    Like
      • Beige Drill
      • Beige_Drill.5
      • 7 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Navy Blue Pegasus  I had a reply from ynab support a few days ago basically saying they hadn’t even considered supporting open banking yet. They provided a link to the Sync for Ynab service. Very disappointing give that I messaged them  many months ago asking when they would support open banking and got the same response then.   

       

      Given that it is the early days of open banking, many banks such as Tesco haven’t yet implemented open banking support, and in their favour at least Sync for YNAB are introducing open banking support where available .  Currently even HSBC’s free open banking app requires you to enter username and password for third party banks - from what I’ve read they’re allowed to use screen scraping in the early days of open banking until it’s all properly implemented.  I’m not willing to use it like that - it just adds greater opportunity for fraud.  However I have great hopes for open banking once it’s supported by all banks and uses proper security whereby customers are not required to enter their passwords on third party sites/apps  

       

      in my opinion YNAB should include Sync for YNAB - it’s part of the core service that they advertise.  They should buy it/license it/provide free subscriptions or whatever.  I also believe that Sync for YNAB is overpriced, if it was a one off £10, or a 99p monthly subscription I might have considered it - but at £2.49 it’s overpriced - especially in comparison to the cost of YNAB itself. 

       

      Currently i I don’t find it too much trouble manually importing OFC files, and as discussed on the ynab podcast, perhaps this greater effort leads to a better appreciation of transactions.  

       

      As for moving to Money Hub - I have 2 reservations. One is that money hub doesn’t provide much information on their web site about what the service provides. I had a look and came away dissatisfied with the level of information. Secondly, I feel significant loyalty to ynab as it has been monumental in changing my approach to managing money.  I’m willing to cut them a bit of slack - but I hope they realise that most customers probably won’t feel the same and if ynab gets left behind, most customers will simply go for whatever is easiest - and once there are many options that support open banking new customers probably won’t even look at ynab. 

      So im torn at the moment - continue manual import of ofc files, pay for Sync for ynab especially once it provides full open banking support, or move to something else. One thing is for certain, I would not move to something other than ynab unless I was absolutely certain it gave me the same understanding and control of my spending.  

      Like 1
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 7 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Beige Drill Hey. Scott from Sync for YNAB here.

      I just pushed an update to our docs to show which banks we support via Open Banking if you are intested in seeing it: https://help.syncforynab.com/platform/which-banks-and-countries-do-you-support.

      As for the pricing, I know it quite a lot in comparison to the YNAB subscription, but sadly the costs of development, support, maintenance and time are still high for me. Any lower, and I would essentially be running the service at break even, or even a loss. And that is before I consider the fact that I am not paying myself properly for my time.

      Once we get to a bigger scale, hopefully we can reduce the prices, but right now it's just not possible. The data providers have minimum monthly commitments etc, which makes it very difficult to drop the prices.

      If you have any feedback, please let me know.

      Like 1
    • Scott Robertson Thanks for the update - I think I'll wait for Tesco and Virgin Money to provide Open Banking support and then I'll try both Sync for YNAB and Money Hub.

      It seems to me that the only way that YNAB would be successful in the UK is if they include Sync for YNAB in the YNAB subscription fee.  You mention getting to a bigger scale could reduce prices - but with cost putting people off and even causing people to look at other options like Money Hub, I'm concerned this may not happen.  Including Sync for YNAB in the YNAB would mean that efficiency of scale would be immediately applied, and by acting quickly (ie. Sync for YNAB is available now - no need to wait for YNAB to slowly consider developing something) they could immediately stem the loss of customers to other Open Banking apps like Money Hub.

      If I were you I would ask for talks with YNAB about a deal to get this integrated into YNABs core service.  Otherwise you and YNAB will lose out as customers look elsewhere.

      Like
  • Like many others here I've signed on with MoneyHub. I might even have considered Sync for YNAB but their coverage is extremely poor and didn't include one of our main credit cards.

    MoneyHub is clearly more limited in its capabilities at present, but I get the impression that they have a much greater ability to develop quickly than the YNAB team. At present I'm doing very little with MoneyHub but I am finding it a time-saver when it comes to importing accounts into YNAB. I no longer log in to each provider and download, just export transactions from MoneyHub, saving a lot of time.

    I'll review the situation at the end of my YNAB subscription but growing irritation at YNAB's clear lack of interest (or maybe capacity) in providing a full service to UK customers will be a major factor. Despite the YNAB team's protestations, the tsunami of applications making use of Open Banking show that it really isn't rocket science any more. If they don't want to go to the trouble of adapting to the UK market, I wish they'd just say so.

    One positive suggestion might be for YNAB to approach a service like MoneyHub with a view to some kind of partnership, with YNAB using MoneyHub as their sync service. In those circumstances I would happily pay the MoneyHub sub and stay with YNAB for its superior budgeting capabilities and philosophy.

    Like
  • Coral Vacuum said:
    Like many others here I've signed on with MoneyHub. I might even have considered Sync for YNAB but their coverage is extremely poor and didn't include one of our main credit cards.

     Which card are you using? I can look at our data providers and see if there is an option available. 

    Like
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 7 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Scott Robertson Sync 4 YNAB is expensive, but as Scott has pointed out he doesn’t yet have the economies of scale. However, having been set up with (near) live importing from First Direct, and more recently Starling, it takes YNAB to another level. Being able to categorise on the go, rather than once a day/week/fortnight is a game changer.

      some will get what they need from MH, but having tried it I couldn’t make the switch. If you are accustomed to YNAB’s methodology I would bite the bullet and get Sync 4 YNAB.

      i ditched credit cards some time ago, so can’t comment on them, but if MH can import then I reckon Sync 4 YNAB can.

      Like 1
  • Scott Robertson I just wanted to take a moment to say thank you for staying active in this thread! It means a lot to have support for Sync for YNAB since we aren't able to offer many details. :)

    Like 1
  • Hi Faness Scott Robertson would it be possible to work out a deal that works for all..... 

     

    As in the current data providers that are only available in the US get pad for those accounts, then Scott acts as the UK provider  (receiving payment for his service)? 

     

    Even if the UK costs are slightly different it sounds like a winner?

    Like 1
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 6 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Turquoise Mainframe I couldn’t agree more. YNAB don’t, through their existing suppliers (who no doubt don’t give their services for free), provide the service that UK YNAB customers require.

      Supporting UK customers by providing a device that does exist, through a UK supplier, seems like a no-brainier. 

      Can’t think of a reason why they wouldn’t.

      YNAB - care to give a response that isn’t just ‘we don’t currently support that but will keep you informed of new features’ ?

      Like
    • Hi Turquoise Mainframe and twhh !

      When we launched the online version of YNAB, we had one Direct Import partner. We have since added two more in order to provide more stable support for a wider range of financial institutions. Our last Direct Import partner was added in hopes of branching out into international direct import support, but it didn't go as we had hoped.

      We're still looking for alternatives to improve direct import and you can submit your suggestions through the Feature Request form. 

      Like
    • Faness I have completed the feature request form as covered in the post.

      How will we know if or when it drops onto the roadmap and when it will arrive?

      It is understandable that it will take time to make progress but it is a feature that many others support.

      Maybe with import providers in the future the contract covers what is expected and ends if not delivered.

      It would be appreciated if you could ask internally and publish outline statistics via country and continent as to where YNAB customers come from (there is no legal restrictions on this because it is anonymous). That way we can understand if it’s just the 4 of us or if there is a significant percentage.

      Like 1
      • Gray Tape
      • Gray_Tape
      • 6 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Faness 

      Hi, 

      Unbelievable that after a year long thread that seems very  clear on what it wants ynab to deliver... And now you ask us to submit a feature request?! 

      For what is worth, I've raised one... But its clear you haven't taken this seriously from the start. 

      Like
    • Turquoise Mainframe Gray Tape

      Thank you both for taking the time to submit a feature request! At this time, international support for direct import isn't in our plans for the immediate future. We'd love to get there someday, but we know it's going to take us a while. We post current projects on our What’s Up Next page, but only once we're close to completing them. With a feature as large as international support, we'll make an announcement in multiple places ( Weekly Roundup, YNAB blog, etc.) once it's in the works.

      As for member statistics, we choose not to share that information. We are continuously growing, but member statistics aren't something we share publicly.

      Like
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 6 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Faness Faness Well at least we all know where we stand - well outside your concern or care. 

       

      You can do this. Easily. But you chose not to. Shame as I've not seen any ground breaking new feature come to the core product of recent.

       

      Makes one wonder what's actually happening at YNAB HQ

      Like
    • twhh I apologize for the inconvenience. We've made a great effort to make direct import available internationally, but we've had to step away for now.

      I don't want you to think we don't care - we do! - but we truly believe that YNAB is worth it even without Direct Import. You can absolutely use YNAB—and get the full benefit—without it. There are many other ways to get your transactions, including entry on your mobile device and File Based Importing.

      While I understand this isn't as convenient, we intended for direct import to be used as a safety net and not as a sole method of importing. We will continue to try to make this possible, but it won't be in the near future. 

      Like
  • FYI - I use FreeAgent which is a uk accountancy service, it links to my Barclays account flawlessly and has done for 5 years. YNAB has no excuse at all for not doing this.

    Like 1
  • Yep - and FreeAgent is owned by NatWest, ie a direct competitor.

    if those competitors can work together to make it happen, why on earth can’t YNAB?

    Like
  • @faness_ynab. One cannot help but feel a little disappointed. 

    Direct import helps with on the fly marking of cleared transactions rather than at the end of the month trying to deal with discrepancies which consumes a large amount of time. 

    The whole idea of using a budgeting tool is to quickly and accurately take control. 

    The ‘not on our road map’ suggests there is very little interest at your end.

    Like
    • Turquoise Mainframe I'm sorry for the disappointment! I understand manual entry isn't as convenient, but frequently reconciling your accounts should prevent any discrepancies from appearing at the end of the month. We recommend reconciling often. 

      There is interest on our end, but we're back to the research stage. We're looking into better alternatives, but we want to set realistic expectations that this won't be a change in the immediate future.

      Like
    • Faness thank you for your candid response. 

      We come back to the original question;

      why go back to the research stage when someone already has a solution?

      At the moment YNAB lags behind competition in this area, the age of the thread, the lack of transparency and absence on the roadmap says a lot more than I could ever. 

      Please can you feed back my dissatisfaction? 

      Like
    • Faness Why are you back to research when other suppliers have been doing this with a 100% hit rate for 5+ years?

      Like
    • Tetsugaku or maybe like syncforynab, which is doing it right now for ynab, and afaik was just something one guy set up on his own. I'm sure it wasn't easy, but it means it's not a many-year project.

      Like
    • Hi Turquoise Mainframe — I can pass that along for you! If you have a moment, the best way to send feedback to our team for a new feature is submitting a Feature Request. That is, if you haven't already! That goes directly to our development team, so you can let them know what you’d like to see going forward.

      Like
    • Tetsugaku Tim Bishop We added our last Direct Import partner in hopes of expanding to international direct import, but things haven't gone as we'd planned. We're still looking for alternatives and listening to all of your feedback (thank you!), but for now, international financial institutions aren't on our path for the immediate future.

      Opening up the YNAB API has certainly led to some great things! Scott Robertson (the developer of Sync for YNAB) has posted some details about that integration earlier on the thread. Our Direct Import partner doesn't currently connect to financial institutions using API, and hope to expand in the future—but they're still working out the kinks.

      Like
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 6 mths ago
      • 5
      • Reported - view

      Tim Bishop running at my scale, Vs running at YNAB scale are very very very different problems.

      It's also worth pointing out. It has been a many year project. Sync for YNAB started as an open source project over 2 years ago. 

      Open banking is not the silver bullet people in this thread think it is. It has endless problems. 

      It's most certainly not a plug and play system that it's being sold to consumers as. Supporting even 1 bank requires weeks of legal work, and development work. And that is before you factor in any maintenance, support training etc. 

      I totally understand that people want this from ynab (it's why I built Sync for YNAB, because I want it too), but people really need to understand that this is not a simple problem to solve like others in here are suggesting. 

      There are people in here getting pretty aggressive with the YNAB team members. Just remember, they are human too and are just doing their jobs. 

      Like 5
    • Scott Robertson  you're right, of course, and working IT I should know that things are rarely as simple as they appear from the outside. Thank you for explaining things from your experiences.

      I suppose the frustration for me comes from having invested so much time and energy in YNAB, over a good number of years, and having personally got a lot out of it. It's totally changed my way of doing things, and being able to pay for unexpected/irregular things without worrying is liberating. But because of that, it can be disappointing to hear that the one killer feature that would make your life loads easier (manually importing by logging in to multiple bank websites takes time...) just isn't going to happen any time soon.

      But I get it, I suppose. They don't have unlimited resources and can't do everything!

      Maybe it's time to give Sync for YNAB another look :-)

      Like 1
      • Scott Robertson
      • syncforynab.com Founder
      • scottrobertson
      • 6 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Tim Bishop the customer passion for YNAB is a double edge sword for the company. 

      People are so invested it in, and just want so much from it that YNAB could never deliver on it all. 

      For example, if they divert resources to Europe, then the US integrations will suffer, and most of their customer base is likely there. 

      Like
  • I think we get it - it’s not a case of “can’t ” do it, but actually “ won’t “ do it.

    Great customer first approach there 🙄

    Like
    • Hi twhh ! I'm so sorry you feel that way. It's not our intention at all! We added our last Direct Import partner in hopes of expanding to international direct import, but things haven't gone as planned. The original international connections were limited, rocky, or didn't work at all—which led to more user frustration.

      We're still looking for alternatives to improve direct import and you can submit your suggestions through the Feature Request form! 

      Like
    • Nicole 

      We added our last Direct Import partner in hopes of expanding to international direct import, but things haven't gone as planned.

      Then you should be working your butts off to get back on plan. Unfortunately, the approach YNAB seems to have taken to international syncing appears to be "we tried once; it didn't work; oh well <shrug; smiley face>". Those of us outside the U.S. are tired of paying full price for an incomplete product. Fix it or offer us a discount for not having international bank sync.

      Like
    • Forest Green Stallion After adding our last Direct Import partner in hopes of expanding direct import internationally, we've learned that adding a new direct import partner doesn't guarantee a fix for direct import issues (international or not). We're looking into alternatives (through internal and external means), but we haven't decided on how best to approach this going forward, which is why international support isn't on our radar for the immediate future. We'll continue to look into improvements here, but it will take some time for us to get closer to an international possibility.

      Like
    • Faness   Then you should discount your product for users outside the US until you figure it out. And before you start talking about about how you don’t build your price structure that way, sorry but no. Part of my (expensive)  annual fee ultimately goes to cover the cost of bank sync for US based users, while I get to enjoy none of the benefit.  

      And no, I am also not persuaded by any arguments about how you recommend manual entries anyway.  In that case, turn off bank sync completely, and reduce everyone’s price. 

      Like 1
      • Til Debt Do Us Part
      • Divorcing Debt - Not Each Other
      • debt_do_us_part
      • 6 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Forest Green Stallion If support keeps saying they wont lower the price for not using direct import, what makes you think theyd lower the price even if no one used it? 

      I really think this suggestion is like poking a bear. Theyd increase the amount before they decrease it. They already have.

      The day YNAB comes out and says $83.99 for accounts without direct import and $89.99 for accounts with it, I will blame this thread.

      Like
  • Sorry, I'm still not sold on the reasoning here. I totally understand Scott Robertson 's points about scale etc, but surely if NatWest - part of the biggest banking group in the UK (and a major global player) - are happy with Yodlee managing their feeds then I reckon YNAB's scale wouldn't be a problem for them.

    Of course, I'm not privy to the legal dealings that would be required by YNAB to deal with Yodlee (or any similar service) but I reckon it'd be no more than they have been used to with their partners in the US.

    I think what's frustrating here is that despite most on the this thread knowing of and experiencing bank feeds in other products - some larger, some much smaller than YNAB - YNAB's response doesn't really hold much water. Other than "were not doing  it" there's no rationale for the reason why not, just that they are not doing it. The only reply is a blunt "put in a feature request" or "we are not going to do it".  

    We're all just left scratching out heads asking why. Coe on YNAB - tell us why this isn't something that you're willing to fix

    Like 1
    • twhh Gray Tape

      After adding our last Direct Import partner in hopes of expanding direct import internationally, we've learned that adding a new direct import partner doesn't guarantee a fix for direct import issues (international or not). While we're looking into alternatives (through internal and external means), we haven't decided on how best to approach this going forward, which is why international support isn't on our radar for the immediate future. We'll continue to look into improvements here, but it will take some time for us to get closer to an international possibility.

      Like
  • It seems simple to me (and I work for a large UK bank and do know some of the complexities re: open banking here)... 

    YNAB has chosen an import partner who doesn't support UK banks. If it has no plans to change this then YNAB should be looking for a new /additional import provider for the UK market. As stated before there are plenty in the market to choose from now and no excuses. 

    If YNAB is not looking at a new provider, then this must be because the UK user population is too small / doesn't matter to them. 

    If this is the case, they should come clean and offer a reduced subscription as the UK product is inferior and they will likely lose what customers they have otherwise. 

    It is frustrating, as I, like many others here, have appreciated the benefits of YNAB up until now.  But, I cannot justify the subscription when its due for renewal given the other apps that are now available. 

    Like 4
  • I agree with others on this thread. I am frustrated with not being able to sync my accounts with YNAB and if this is not dealt with I won't be renewing my subscription. It's a shame because it's a good product but without bank integration it's VERY time consuming when you have multiple accounts and credit cards.

    Like
  • Hi, All, 

               One would ask for a bit of tolerance on both sides here. 

    YNAB; it would be good if you could agree to share an insight into the business decisions with regards to the international market to help build some form of relationship with the products UK users. The current statements are simply unhelpful.

    Customers of YNAB; I feel your pain & are part of your group. Let YNAB explain what they are going to do for us and then decide if it’s worth sticking with the product?

    Like 1
      • John Smith
      • JohnSmith
      • 6 mths ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Turquoise Mainframe To be fair it started very politely but then degenerated (over a year!) because YNAB keep making poor excuses - it's no good saying they can't do it, when so many other providers have managed it without any issue at all for years and years now. If they were a little more honest about it, there wouldn't be so much anger.

      Like 2
    • Tetsugaku 

      Like
  • Faness said:
    ... , which is why international support isn't on our radar for the immediate future.

    Turquoise Mainframe statements like this does not help. I ditched YNAB in favour of MoneyHub months ago and have not looked back. £10 vs £65 a year is a massive difference for not much extra functionality. I much rather loose the YNAB envelope budgeting in favour of time savings I gain with MoneyHub.

    Like 1
    • Turquoise Cyborg Tetsugaku absolutely agree & I will be joining moneyhub at expiry too. YNAB please respond?

      Like
    • Turquoise Mainframe You dont have to wait for expiry, when I cancelled my YNAB subscription the prorated my refund

      Like 2
  • I've signed up to this, for UK residents this looks very good.

    https://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/emma-money-management/id1270062373?mt=8

    Like
      • monkeyhanger
      • No animals were harmed
      • monkeyhanger.1
      • 6 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Alice Blue Piccolo Always keen on opinions from someone using it. From what I can see it's not close to being a direct competitor for my needs and wants but I like to keep an eye out on what's out there. I'd need the pro version and that works out at more than I pay for YNAB for what looks like less functionality but then I am on the grandfathered pricing.

      Desktop access is much higher up my list of priorities than direct import. I like the mindfulness of spending 5 minutes on my budget with a cuppa each morning.

      Like 1
      • twhh
      • twhh
      • 6 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      monkeyhanger and it’s built off Facebook... not sure I’m comfortable with that given their approach to privacy

      Like
      • monkeyhanger
      • No animals were harmed
      • monkeyhanger.1
      • 5 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      twhh Definitely off the list then. I'm not sure I'd be happy giving YNAB my bank log in details if direct import was an option in the UK, let alone anything linked with Facebook.

      Like
  • Morning YNAB,  Are you speaking to Truelayer?  

    TrueLayer, the London-based provider of APIs to the banking industry, has successfully raised $35m in Series C funding. The funding round was led by Temasek and Tencent and brings the total raised to date to $47m. The company intends to use the funds to support its growth in Europe and globally.

    TrueLayer provides API functionality that enables the flow of data between banks and the new wave of third-party service providers, borne out of Open Banking. The company is already working with a number of major institutions as well as other FinTech startups (see: *New Research” Open Banking momentum starts to build).

    Over the last twelve months TrueLayer has secured a number of significant partnerships with stakeholders in the Open Banking ecosystem in Europe, including: Zopa; ClearScore; CreditLadder; Canopy; Plum; BitBond; Emma and Anorak. In February, the company launched one of Europe’s first, Open Banking based, payments APIs. This latest investment highlights the growing market for Open Banking services and follows similar news last week, in respect of API provider, Yapily (see: Yapily attracts $5.4m as Open Banking market expands).

    The market opportunity for vendors such as TrueLayer and Yapily is not limited to the European banking reforms. On a global basis, the growth of Open Banking and API-enabled access to data, is facilitating the growth of third-party providers and contributing to the transformation of financial services across a number of territories and jurisdictions.

    Like 2
    • Hi Tomato Colt !

      Thanks for sharing that information! TrueLayer sounds like a real up and coming contender! Would you mind submitting that information through our Feature Request form or email it to help@ynab.com? That's the best way to get it in front of our development team for further consideration. :)

      Like 1
      • Tomato Colt
      • Tomato_Colt.1
      • 5 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Faness Morning, submitted a Feature Request just now.  All the best

      Like 1
    • Tomato Colt Thank you! We appreciate it.  😄

      Like
  • Hi Faness any movement with syncing non UK Banks.

    Like
    • Hi Tomato Colt !

      Not yet! Direct import for non-US or Canadian based institutions isn't in our immediate future. We hope to bring this feature to YNAB in the future, but it will take us some time to make it available. Some YNABers have used our api to create add-ons that Work with YNAB. Currently, Sync for YNAB provides direct import for UK banks but it is an additional fee.

      Once this option is available, we'll be sure to announce it loud and clear in the Release Notes and you can also sign up for the Weekly Roundup! :)

      Like 1
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