Show transactions in order of entering

Is it possible to order transactions by the time I entered them, such that they are in the same order as on my bank statement?

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  • No it is not possible. You can try submitting a feature request.

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  • Can you elaborate why you want those to match? The bank order isn't guaranteed to match the spending order because of variable delays in vendor processing.

    If you're manually entering transactions while looking at the bank statement, you can clear them right then and there and reconcile. Outside of clearing/reconciliation, I can't think of a reason you would be comparing YNAB to the bank statement.

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  • I know that I can reconcile by clearing, but this still requires a lot of searching:

    - Sometimes I don't have time to enter all transactions of a given day, when I want to continue later I have to first go through all the transactions of that day on my bankaccount to find the first one that is not yet in YNAB, instead of just looking at the top one in YNAB and starting from there

    - When reconciling I can indeed clear transactions in order, but because they are not in the right order I have to really search for every transaction before I clear it. Kind of a hassle, if they were in the right order I could easily spot which one is wrong.

    - Actually, even entering the transactions themselves is very error prone, because the last transaction that I entered it. It happens to me quite often that I accidentally skip a transaction or enter one twice because of this.

    I submitted a feature request now to match order of entering and/or provide functionality to reorder by dragging.

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    • Salmon Guitar If you have that volume of transactions, you might consider using File Based Import. The window doesn't have to be precise, so just overlap a day or week past when you know have all transactions.

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  • Thanks for the suggestion :). I have tried it before but I ended up having to correct so many things from the file my bank gave me that it took me more time than just manually entering. I also prefer to keep a close eye on my budget: if I have the time, I enter a transaction right after I do it (resulting in some of the inconveniences described above). 

    So, it is not that I have any real problems, I just think it would be more convenient if my transactions weren't automatically reordered. I can imagine that from a back end perspective there might be difficulties with what I'm requesting (or it might even be impossible), but I still wanted to submit the request in case other people might experience the same inconveniences. 

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    • Salmon Guitar I agree.  I’ve always wanted “time of entry” ordering, as it makes the most sense to me.  But there seems to always be a reason I am doing it wrong, or there’s a workaround, or “if I did it the YNAB way” then it wouldn’t matter, etc.  But I’m old school I guess.  I make a purchase, I enter in YNAB, and then I open my bank website and try to reconcile, and despite other users experiences, I see them in order of when I made the purchase, and I would love to just either have YNAB respect when I entered it, or let me “drag n drop”, it does not.  I would like this so I can just look at the bank website, drag the purchase down/up and fee it would help me reconcile better.  Some people disagree, which is fine, but to me, it makes sense to just include the time of entry and allow me to sort by it or drag and drop. In fact, I still use YNAB4, and find lack of an “Undo” and “drag n drop” sort of surprising it wasn’t in that version, it’s still pretty nuts they don’t let you do it now in the online version.  But they seemed to be focused on reinventing the wheel (new YNAB mobile app) instead of adding functionality that helps people actually budget, like ordering, or reimbursement solutions. 🤷🏼‍♂️

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  • a_different_joel said:
     I would like this so I can just look at the bank website, drag the purchase down/up and fee it would help me reconcile better.

    I think you answered your own question. As soon as you find it -- in order to drag it -- just clear it then and there, and you're done with it. No need to drag AND clear when you can just clear.

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    • dakinemaui the point is to find missed transactions, from my wife or myself.  If I just go in order entered or bank, it’s totally obvious someone missed entering  a transaction.  Beyond that, I just don’t understand why it would be ordered any different than what I entered it in.  It’s an excuse.  It’s not hard to include a time stamp.

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    • dakinemaui also just want to apologize in advance.  There’s probably zero arguments you can make for why at least the *option* for ordering by entry time isn’t available, or even default.  Especially for all the non US based users who have to put up with “we think manual entry is just as good so we charge you the same” users when bank import is nonexistent that it’s not the default.  I honestly will never understand why the items wouldn’t be ordered by the time you entered them... I’ll let you give it a whirl.  I admit I like a lot of your advice from every other aspect of YNAB and on these forums, and would love to be proved wrong, so if you’re up for it, let’s give it a go :)

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    • Also, drag and drop is sort of the “backup” to actual timed entry ordering, just to fix things up when needed. If it was ordered when I entered it in YNAB, no drag n drop needed.  But I might miss something, or my wife, and need to drag it to see everything clearly.  
       

      I’n happy for you that YNAB is all that it can be and needs no improvements.  I wish I was so lucky.

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    • a_different_joel You must go down the bank's list if you want to find a missing transaction. You either find it (uncleared) in YNAB (and clear it) or not (and enter+clear). Again, you're done at that point without any dragging whatsoever.

      I get you want it, but it really is not needed for reconciliation. YNAB knows this, so I suspect they will ignore any feature request with reconciliation as a justification. They have been getting such requests for more than a decade and haven't implemented it in any of the versions of YNAB.

      Just trying to save you some effort. 

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    • a_different_joel Oh, I have a slew of improvements I'd like to see. I've put in Feature Requests for them. That's the process you should also pursue if you want them to even possibly listen to you.

      My best wishes don't mean much, but you have them!

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    • dakinemaui Your best wishes are indeed appreciated.  My goal may be improving 'the time to find' the transaction then?  Imagine two lists... left and right, as you move up looking left and right, they all match, because... you know... you entered them at the time of purchase and it matches your CC...then boom, no match... OK, now is 'find' time... look up a little bit in the YNAB side - did anyone enter it late? yes/no... fix via drag n drop or enter it.  When crap is all jacked up from the wife entering stuff to the wrong card, or not entering it, or it sorted in a 'weird' (my words) way, it takes longer, no?  I am seriously missing something simple here if you think it's easier to reconcile a bunch of transactions that don't match the order they are in the CC side... I am obtuse.

      Can you explain why why at least you think it's OK that you enter something at 9PM and it appears before something that happened at 8PM?  Yeah... depends on the amount... sure... but I mean seriously...  why not just keep it in the order it was entered in?  Maybe that's my other point... why not just keep it... the way... it was entered...?

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    • a_different_joel Because it won't always match the bank anyway? If I have 2 receipts in my pocket, it's random which I'll enter first. If I have 5, it could be very mismatched.

      If it helps, YNAB is obviously a US company, and the order of transactions processed by banks on the same day is mandated by law to be largest inflow to largest outflow. This minimizes the number of overdrafted transactions. YNAB simply matches that.

      FWIW, I sort by outflow amount when reconciling. Even with a slight error the transaction is close by (or it's not been entered).

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    • a_different_joel The easiest way I've found to reconcile a bunch of transactions is to import a OFX, QIF, or similar file. I'll manually do my low traffic accounts, but I can't beat the import when there are a bunch -- especially when SOMEONE 🙄 didn't enter them in YNAB at all.

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    • dakinemaui Understood, and thanks for your info.  I don't use the 'receipts in my pocket' method.  I use the mobile app and enter as I go.  Additionally, I have e-mail alerts on all transactions on all cards, and archive the emails once entered in YNAB, thus preserving order.  But when 'someone' 😆 misses a transaction... it would just be nice to see it.  I am in the US and all my transactions (BECU, Citi, Capital Once, and Amazon) show in the order the transaction took place.  A checking account may withdrawal funds in some specific order, but I don't use a Debit card and I'm not buying the 'following the US' stuff.  Anyway, appreciate your feedback.  I still don't get why YNAB chooses to destroy the timestamp on entry and not let me drag n drop. 

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    • My transactions are generally taken care of with the e-mail thing... but 'others' don't enter as well as me.  And yes... 'they' sometimes archive things in the email that haven't been entered, unintentionally.  So I'm not saying there's some improvements that can't be made on my side as well 😜.  Again, thanks for the feedback.  Cheers.

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      • Ceeses
      • Ceeses
      • 1 yr ago
      • Reported - view

      a_different_joel Since I also deal with "others" and in my case "others" don't ever open YNAB, here is what I was doing before the file-import worked well. 
      1. Unclear everything since the last reconciliation. Sort by "clear/unclear"
      2. Check on the bank account when the running balance was equal to the now cleared balance.
      3. Go up one transaction on the bank side, find in YNAB, clear. It is now moved to the "bottom" of the list in YNAB (that's the only cleared transaction)
      4. Keep going. The transactions I haven't checked in YNAB are at the top of the screen and the ones I've validated are at the bottom. So it might still be a long list of transactions to shift through if I haven't checked for some time, but at least they are all grouped together at the top of the list.

      My CC doesn't give a running balance which is annoying. So in that case, I made sure I would check at least every other day and reconcile everytime I had finished. Finding the last transaction I had reconciled to took a bit more time but the rest was the same afterwards. This way the list of transactions was manageable. But I would still sort by clear/unclear so I could quickly see the transactions I needed to check in YNAB.

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    • dakinemaui That might actually be a point, for me the transactions in my bank statement are ordered by the time I paid (or the time the payment came through, typically this is more or less the same). I enter like @a_different_joel, going through the transactions in my bank-app.

      Look, I get that there might be a ton of other things that have more priority, or that our wishes are just useful for Europeans, and that is fine. We can deal with it. It is a tad annoying though that whenever I ask something here I just get a condescending answer that what I want isn't needed. For me and a_different_joel it might genuinely be easier if we could have the transactions in the order matching the bank statement, and that for you they are anyways in that order, or that you don't order them in that way really is absolutely irrelevant.

      Wee understand there are a ton of stuff to improve and that what is good for us is not necessarily good for the majority of people, and we will be fine if what would make our experience better isn't implemented. That said, I really don't understand why you cannot just acknowledge that this may be useful for us, instead of saying that our request is nonsensical or insist that finding  matching transactions in two list with different orders is just as easy as finding matching transactions in two lists that have the same order (I honestly don't even understand how you can seriously make that point). There is really no need to get so defensive, obviously we still like YNAB despite some choices we might have liked to see differently, we are still using it. So, please, just be a bit more respectful.

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    • Salmon Guitar said:
      I enter [...] going through the transactions in my bank-app

       When I see logical inconsistencies, I will point them out. Based on your description (quoted), you can clear immediately while entering and transaction order is not an issue for reconciliation. (FWIW, I don't think that's how Joel predominantly enters.)

      I understand you feel a change would make it easier. I'm merely trying to be helpful by suggesting slight changes to your workflow that would ALSO be easier AND can be done with the existing product.

      Try them or ignore then as you see fit. Or discuss in what cases you feel they wouldn't work well. That's what I feel I've done, and I'm sorry you see that as disrespectful.

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  • I always manually enter transactions - YNAB apparently can't import from my bank - and I reconcile all accounts every day. (I have a husband and 3 teenaged kids who apparently can't remember for more than 24 hours what they purchased and why!) Takes me about 10 minutes while my coffee is brewing...

    But before I did this I would just reconcile my credit cards from the bottom up (on the CC website). I would just find the running balance on the CC activity that matched my YNAB working balance and move up from there. Even if things weren't in the exact order they were usually within 2 or 3 transactions so not that hard to find... (I use QuickBooks at work and have the same issue but multiplied by 10 so maybe I'm just used to it)

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  • Salmon Guitar said:
    finding  matching transactions in two list with different orders is just as easy as finding matching transactions in two lists that have the same order (I honestly don't even understand how you can seriously make that point).

    About this specifically... I would not insist it is just as easy. However, you've assumed the order in the second case, which is not guaranteed to be true in the real world. I've pointed out how delays in entry can lead to a mismatch from transaction approval order.

    So yes, I agree entry order would solve that assumed problem. I'm just more interested in addressing the actual problem.

    Yes, I noticed in your case you said that you enter based on the bank app, which indeed means YOUR scenario is exactly the assumed problem. However, the overall goal is to reconcile. By clearing immediately, you completely side-step the transaction order issue without waiting on YNAB to do anything.

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  • dakinemaui said:
    the order of transactions processed by banks on the same day is mandated by law to be largest inflow to largest outflow.

     Thanks for this info. This is helpful as I am sometimes frustrated by the transaction lineup and wonder why it's in the order it is. 

     

    dakinemaui said:
    I sort by outflow amount when reconciling

     Can you elaborate on this? I clicked on "Outflow" at the top of the screen, but the first transaction was months ago.

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    • B's Gambit it works best if you hide previously reconciled transactions. Also, click it again to sort the other direction or scroll to the other end of the list.

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    • dakinemaui Got it, thanks!

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  • Logging in for the first time in a very long time to share my support. This has been bugging me for years. It's mildly inconvenient when reconciling, but mostly it's just irritating to enter two transactions and have them immediately, before my eyes, switch places.

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  • I would say +1 to this. Even more so since the partial balance column introduction.  I usually keep track of my partial balance by dates. I would suggest that the "DATE" field had an optional "TIME" for the transaction. So, this way we can  sort the transactions by the order they came up and compare the partial balance correctly... My biggest issue is that sometimes this column shows the running balance as negative but it was never negative, it's just because YNAB keeps sorting the inflows and then the outflows backwards. 

    This way if you don't set the time for the transaction it defaults to the current sorting algorithm, but if you set the time it will sort taking that into account.

     

    Cheers! 

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    • Gold Python Would you be willing to submit your thoughts on this to our design team? I'm particularly curious about how you find that specific running balance useful on a given day - that would be a great detail to include. 😊

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  • I have logged the following with the design team:

    Due to the default ordering of transactions, YNAB shows that my cheque account goes into overdraft when it in fact doesn't, as I have transferred funds in on the same day to cover the expense. I love YNAB more than any other budgeting tools because the psychological/habit aspects of money management are built into the way the application works. Because of YNAB I have conquered my overdraft (thank you!). So being able to look at my cheque account in the register and not see any red balances is a matter of pride for me and a big motivation to keep it that way. But because YNAB sorts by biggest outflow to biggest inflow it shows overdrafts when there are not any. So there are two suggestions to solve this. 1] Have a settings option to sort by either biggest outflow to biggest inflow OR biggest inflow to biggest outflow 2] Allow for drag an drop manual sorting on each day. Pretty please.

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      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Cadet Blue Wrench I agree that the intra day sort order seems to be processing backwards and not correct when transactions are sorted in ascending order by date (newest on bottom).

      For the time being, change your date sort to descending so newest are on the top and it should be okay.

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    • nolesrule Thanks for the suggestion. Both ways, ascending and descending date order, don't always list inflows first for intraday transactions though, which is what I want.

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      • nolesrule
      • Stealing From the Future fix is an improvement but is incomplete....
      • nolesrule
      • 2 wk ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Cadet Blue Wrench I forgot, you can jigger with the intra day sort order by clicking on one of the other sort columns and then clicking on date to sort again.

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    • nolesrule Round of applause! That does the trick, thanks!

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      • Superbone
      • YNAB convert since 2008
      • Superbone
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Cadet Blue Wrench Another option would be to not run your checking account so tight that intraday transactions could show you overdrafted. Give yourself a little more buffer.

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    • Superbone true, just maximising interest earned. So I have a savings account earning 5% interest (I earn nothing on my cheque account) so transfer in on the same day that all my payments go off :) 

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      • Superbone
      • YNAB convert since 2008
      • Superbone
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Cadet Blue Wrench Nice. I'd like to know more about your 5% interest savings account! That's crazy high in this current environment.

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    • Superbone I live in South Africa, so different environment altogether 😀. Inflation is around 3.5% soon that makes the real interest rate 1.5%. Still better than most US saving accounts I think.

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    • Cadet Blue Wrench Thanks for submitting that feature request!

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