Todd My recommendation for on-demand refresh would be to still limit the # per certain time.  Let me trigger it but once I do, I can't trigger it again for 4-6-8 hours.  With the current approach,  if ynab triggers it at 4 am but my bank doesn't finish updating the previous transactions until 6 am, then I have to wait until noon to get my transactions.  I usually do my updates at 7 or 8 am. If I was able to trigger it then I'd get all my transactions at once.  Now if one institution updates at 3 am and another at 5 am, i get half now and half later.   I'd rather you not connect at all until I'm ready to work on it.  Also I have some institutions that don't update anything over the weekend.  You are hitting them every 8 hours for no reason.   I think it is easy to work around the concern of users pounding the institutions with connection attempts but still give us the ability to get transactions when we can actually make use of them.

Hey Herman thanks for chiming in. I wanted to add something to this timing question you raise.

Different financial institutions have different rhythms, different schedules. In many cases update/refresh times are selected to try and be smart in relation to those, as opposed to just triggering a global update at (for example) 4am, or triggering one every X hours for all institutions. In that way, the same thing goes for your weekend example—if an institution typically has nothing new to offer over certain periods of time, the refresh schedule is dialed back during those periods.

Like I said, this doesn't mean it can't get better, to make your experience better, and we're working on that.

Todd I totally understand and and this is all the more reason to just let the user trigger when they sit down to work and then limit the number of times they are allowed to request transactions.  I can tell you from experience the providers trying to manage those schedules is not working well. That said, I'm fine with direct import the way it is working and it is not critical to me but this simple change would make it far more useful.

Herman  I appreciate it.

This, for me, is all about availability of transactions, which I'd like to see get better across the board. That's also also why I'm high on making pending transactions available. It's not your issue directly, but it supports a similar sort of need—make my transactions available more quickly.

Todd I'm actually not interested at all in pending transactions and I'm of the opinion that they should not be imported.    I'm not really overly concerned about speed.  For me it is consistency and convenience.  I'd like to be able to sit down and consistently pull in everything that is available.  Today I  sit down and because ynab checked for transactions 5 hours ago,   I can not get the posted transactions that were made available 2 hours ago.   Because  of this i have to either manually reconcile or wait and reconcile that account later.   If I controlled the timing, when I'm ready the transactions I care about would also be ready.

Herman If you're not concerned about speed, maybe it was a mistake for me to frame it that way, because I feel like we're on the same page. Bottom line, I'd like you to have your transactions when you sit down to budget. One way I think of accomplishing that is getting them made available quickly.  But I get what you're saying. 

Todd I think speed is important but i'm focused on control.  That right transactions at the right time.  Speed definitely is a by product of that and I'm in favor of it!

Todd Yes, I have the pending beta (not a beta that's pending 😉) and I really like seeing my soon to be imported transactions. I just wish I could choose which ones to enter now! Then it would be perfect. Currently, I'm forced to type them in myself if I want them in.

Superbone Glad to hear they are helpful for you. You actually have the old beta that only made them visible. We never shipped it because it fell short in a couple of ways, and then the Plaid acquisition of Quovo interrupted the improvements. In any event, the current version (which is really in sort of an alpha, you'll see it soon enough) allows you to easily edit and convert them to regular transactions.

Todd Beautiful!

Todd SyncForYNAB is an excellent option for those of us outside the US. It does add to the cost quite a bit, but works very well.

Is there not an option for YNAB to officially integrate with them? I'm sure it'd be mutually beneficial.

Todd Thanks for your explanation, much appreciated!

@Todd Whilst you have 4 partners for the US and Canada just 1 syncforynab.com could cover the UK, EU and is already moving into NZ and Australia. It works brilliantly! I don't begrudge paying SyncforYnab the $33 a year for a top service but I do begrudge paying YNAB for a service it can't or wont provide. Perception is reality right? It just feels that the ROW isn't really part of the game plan, particularly as there is a working solution which you even promote. Do a deal please.

Todd Whilst you have 4 partners for the US and Canada just 1 syncforynab.com could cover the UK, EU and is already moving into NZ and Australia. It works brilliantly! I don't begrudge paying SyncforYnab the $33 a year for a top service but I do begrudge paying YNAB for a service it can't or wont provide. Perception is reality right? It just feels that the ROW isn't really part of the game plan, particularly as there is a working solution which you even promote. Do a deal please.

Tomato Colt You can say that again!

@Superbone  I've got used to asking the kids twice I hoped it was a technique which might work here too

Tomato Colt That's both interesting and sad that someone in the UK had to create their own integration solution for it. 

I just checked the website, and it looks to me like it's 43 UK Pounds paid annually.  That converts to about $53 USD. That's more than half again the cost of the service.

That really is a sad thing.
Stephen

Stephen Kirven  Hi, just checked my syncforynab account and I am paying £26.50 a year.  Not as bad as you thought but too much when YNAB said it was part of the new subscription service.  
It works brilliantly as the EU has regulated open banking.  The only time I have to touch it is Every 90 days you have to re-authorise access to the accounts you want to sync which takes seconds.  
It is so simple in EU countries that apps which don’t sync with bank accounts effectively are the odd ones out.  Don’t understand YNAB approach to this other than the UK & EU aren’t big enough markers for them

Orchid Pilot I also have accounts and BMO and TD, and I would like direct import to work. In fact, import is reliable for exactly one account: my American Express card.

Orchid Pilot I’m happy to report that I’m now able to connect to all the major Canadian banks. Finally!!! Hope this update sticks and continues to work. Thanks YNAB team!! 

10SNE1 Simply awesome! Both my primary accounts linked without issue...perfect. I did get good at downloading the data every morning but this will be a nice QOL upgrade and we can all use that these days. 

Thank you, you guys have been so patient with end users and this linking issue...should be a nice relief for you guys. Well done.

Orchid Pilot So glad to hear it. We know it won't be universally so smooth. But it's all about forward progress, and I'm happy your experience was a good one.

Neil As Faness said, good idea to reconcile.

I want to be transparent that there is some possibility of duplication, but the team has spent a lot of time on that particular issue in prepping for the switch, and I would hope any issues are small (confined to dates close to the actual switch, as opposed to duplicating heaps of historical data). I would be much less concerned about data loss—especially because of how you "own" those transactions in your register after import.

Forest Green Stallion 

So are we getting direct import in EU or not?

I’m sure it’s not a satisfying answer, but all I can offer you is a genuine one: we don’t know. 

When we launched in 2016, we were excited to have some international support (it was mostly in the UK at the time, but that seemed like it might be a “foothold” for the future). As I mentioned, we never set out to then integrate with another three partners in the following years. But that’s been the focus, and hasn’t left space for expanding that beyond the US and Canada. The fact that Plaid offers international support is a real positive, but doesn't mean I can answer your question with a "yes" or "no".

The EU is quite frankly the most stable, standardized & mature environment you could find (for a market of this size at least). It would probably be easier even to offer direct import here than the U.S. 

As far as being stable and standardized, that may absolutely be the case—that’s why I mentioned the EU above. There are likely some technical/regulatory advantages, but also some complications, which (when it comes to Europe) include the fact that YNAB is not or doesn’t have a UK or EU entity. That would be a not-small step we would need to take in order offer direct import in either of those places.

The price is simply too high

I wouldn’t want anyone paying for the service or the product if you don’t feel it is worth it. I hope that customers in the UK, EU, Australia, New Zealand (you name it...) experience that value in the form of financial progress in their own lives. I'm excited about 2020 and what's coming for all YNAB users everywhere.

Todd So whats coming then? Because when we look back at the last few years, what we see is mostly bug fixes and superficial improvements that existing users don't care all that much about. So what then can we look forward to in 2020? Because I have asked before. Because I honestly (rightfully) expect more from a SaaS product. I would love for 2020 the year YNAB starts making real improvements, but I won't lie and say I really believe at this point. 

Forest Green Stallion As it relates to import, I'm trying to be as transparent as possible about what the snags are we've hit over the years and what's on the table right now. Like I said elsewhere, though, I don't want this thread to turn into a global discussion about all the things, so will keep it focused on the import changes.

What I don't understand is why the Plaid integration is limited to US and Canada. I've used Plaid myself as a developer, it's not difficult to add other banks from a technical POV (its adding more country codes to a list). Is it a regulatory issue ?

Todd 

Todd Then please tell us about some of the meaningful improvements that we’re going to see this year that aren’t related to import.

I would love to see anything on the horizon, because most of us are getting pretty frustrated how stagnant the product is. We pay nearly $100 a year for something that’s not getting improved. If you want to go SaaS, then you need to keep improving the product.  But that’s not happening with YNAB. Small, superficial changes get rolled out, but the larger more important items that we’ve been asking for years for never happen. As a result, many of us are getting pretty frustrated and feel quite cheated.

Forest Green Stallion for what its worth YNAB works really well for me.  The methodology and the app get the right balance; I think, between simplicity and effectiveness.  What does irk me though Todd is the perception I'm paying for something I was told i could have and it isn't there.   This frustration is doubled because of @YNAB's  repeated suggestions we sign up with @syncforynab  and pay extra!! 

dakinemaui What a phenomenal question, thank you.

So, at the core of YNAB, and the core of many people hire YNAB to do, is to take total control of your money. Big-picture & long-term we all know this about way more than your transactions, which I often think of a one of the raw materials of your budget—they're not your budget, but your budget rests on them, along with your goals, aspirations, income, needs, etc. etc.

Sorry, I'm going off the rails here already. ;) 

As I was saying, eventually, we hope that total control results in really important things: safety, security, money in the bank, paid-off debt, and the ability to plan and make choices aligned with your aspirations.

But before you get to that point (and even well along the way for many people), total control begins with simply having a better handle on the day-to-day of a 21st-century financial life. Like, knowing that you have a bill due or that a transaction you forgot about just hit your account can be a massive step forward in control. For some, total control comes first from simply being organized for the very first time. It feels secure, it feels like the genesis of a plan, and this supports the progression to the bigger-picture goals. Having transactions hit your account sooner supports people in that sort of progress (whether you import-only or mix import with other entry methods).

Now, that framing obviously sounds like "new user". And it certainly can be. But my experience is that veteran YNABers appreciate this type of information flow. It gives continued confidence—I know this happened in real life, I want to see it in YNAB too. 

On a much more practical level (but still under that total control idea), the sooner a transaction is ready for import, the less likely it is that people hit situations like  Herman is describing. If you only work in your budget on Friday evenings, speed of availability is probably not a big deal. But if your routine is more frequent, the sooner we can get that transaction available, the more likely it is you'll be working with all the information you need.

Todd I am picking up on a strong desire for awareness and accurate plans. Yet YNAB has dug in their heels against requests for future-dated transactions that immediately impact category balances at the user's discretion. Such a feature promotes that same awareness.

(For example, better awareness is provided when the funds for the Amazon Subscription items outflowing in 2 weeks are NOT shown as Available to spend in the Grocery category.)

In the pending transaction context, listing those does provide a heads up something is coming. Might users have a capability to easily promote a pending transaction to a real transaction? Hopefully it's obvious this would then impact category balances and thereby influence subsequent spending decisions, possibly days before actually clearing.

dakinemaui I'm going to leave aside the future-dated issue, because I want to keep this thread focused on import. I'll just say "point taken".

When it comes to pending transactions.

Might users have a capability to easily promote a pending transaction to a real transaction?

Yes.* 

Hopefully it's obvious this would then impact category balances and thereby influence subsequent spending decisions, possibly days before actually clearing.

Yes.*

(*which is to say: that's how it is working in the pre-release version I am currently using, it's not in your hands until it's in your hands. )

Orange Koala tha

Thank you! I think I was able to fix it using the trouble-shooting link in the form. Love this app and great customer service!

Superbone Your accounts are connected through another import partner, MX—who we will continue to work with. You won't see the update, and it's not related—just coincidence with a recent change they've made.

Generally, we include active issues impacting our top 20 institutions on the status page (Schwab is not one), and only after we've been able to confirm they're widespread. Our importing team will keep tabs on the situation, and they're always happy to check on the status!

Nicole Thanks for the info. In the interface when trying to connect, it does say that there’s a widespread issue with Charles Schwab US but that’s all the info given. My recommendation would be to add the info that I got after following up with support. Otherwise, I have no timeframe for when it might be fixed and I was going through the hassle of trying to update it every day. Now I know I can relax and wait until I get the go ahead from support that it has been fixed.

Anything you can do to reduce the unknowns for your customers is appreciated. It’s not so fun being left in the dark.

Superbone Thanks for clarifying! I passed your feedback on to our importing team. Yes, we mention the widespread issue in the app but the details themselves can change (and the note needs to be mobile-friendly too)—so writing in is best. Then we're able to tag your account and reach out when we have actionable news. Timelines are...rare to receive, but we're cautiously optimistic!

Magenta Piranha I heard back from support about Charles Schwab US. I would hope they don't mind me sharing this information. They should put it on the YNAB Status page and the internal message that shows when trying to connect:

Charles Schwab is currently blocking access from some third-parties (which include our data aggregators) at this time, in order to prioritize customer-based traffic to their online banking.

While we've been given a tentative timeframe of just a few weeks, it could go on longer if Schwab determines it necessary.

Superbone Did this ever started working for you? My Schwab connection has been broken for months now. Luckily it's not one of my primary accounts, but it's super irritating. I have to constantly relink it to have it refresh balance.

Tomato Gazelle Yes, I was only out a week at most. Only had to reconnect.

Bruce This is where I'm at. Some of my accounts say "a day ago" and some say "8 hours ago". It's frustrating not being able to trigger myself when it's been more than a certain number of hours.

Peppr2 All of mine say "2 days ago". :( Things have gotten far worse since the update.

Bruce Did YNAB ask you to update your accounts? Just curious as mine didn't and mine all say "an hour ago" at the moment.

Superbone It asked me a few days ago.

Superbone Yes, mine did ask me to update.  I went through each account, and did a reconcile before hitting the update, but Yes, I did get a request, and went through the process.

Purple Nomad Silver Cheetah Please report a Bank Importing Issue here, and our team will be happy to look into those connections for you!

Nicole I was prompted to reconnect to 2 of my banks this morning.  In both cases, I had to confirm 2 separate text messages.  Once confirmed twice, the accounts reconnected.

Nicole So 4 of my 5 accounts are current (Amex is only 12 hours old).  I have one checking account that hasn't updated in 2 days.  If it doesn't reconnect tomorrow, I'll report a Bank Importing Issue, per your recommendation.

Silver Cheetah My Capital One Checking account hasn't updated for 3 days, so I reported the issue this morning.  

Silver Cheetah Nicole any updates on the capital one issues?  Its been a pain forever with constant 2FA logins.  But now since the updated on the Plaid import, I have to actually re-login with a password and then go through two rounds of text message 2FA codes.  what's going on? a big pain

Orange Sound Please get in touch with support directly if you haven't already—we may be able to help!

Purple Nomad Our team can look into that for you! Can you let us know more details about your connection, when you have a moment? And we'll investigate. Thank you!

Nicole Most my account are working now, except my Wells Fargo account always requires me to put in the credentials, and always makes me do the code that the bank texts me twice. Capital One isn't working at the moment at all, but I know that issue has been reported.

Blue Zebra Thanks for filling out the bank issue form! Our importing team will look closer at that USAA connection, and be in touch soon.

Blue Zebra A week later, I continue to have the same issue with USAA imports.  And going through the two factor process twice takes for-ev-er!  Or at least it seems that way because you have to watch it like a hawk because it might time out and force your to start over.  Or if it doesn't, you still have to watch it like a hawk, because the UI won't do anything until you confirm that you see that it worked, and it *will* still time out if you don't do that fast enough.

Chris Akers I'm having the same problem with Capital One. Can you please explain to me how to import the qfx file? It sounds like it might be a faster way to keep current.

Friendly_gal Friendly_gal When you are viewing your account transactions on the Capital One website, you will see a link at the top right of the transactions list that says Download Transactions. Click that, choose QFX as the file type, 30 day date range. Then, you can just drag and drop that file right into your account in YNAB. It will ignore transactions that have already been imported. Works well for me, much less painful that direct import at the moment.

Chris Akers Thanks, Chris. I actually did the download, but when I opened it, I got a message that I didn't have an application associated with that type of file and referred me to a default apps settings page to create one. I can't find that page...

Chris Akers Chris Akers  Hi Chris. I just figured out that I didn't have to create an association. I just dragged the file into YNAB as you suggested and it imported.  Unfortunately, none of the transactions matched the ones that I had manually input so I ended up deleting them all. The amounts were all correct but I guess it couldn't match Amazon with AMZN, etc. Don't know if that would have happened with direct import, but I appreciate the help!

Friendly_gal Don't open it. Drag it directly into the YNAB web app.

Superbone Just figured it out and did just that. Thanks for the response!

Friendly_gal Yes, we cross-posted. You can manually match those transactions and then next time they will most likely match automatically. To match them, select the two transactions you want to match and go up to the Edit menu in the top left and select Match.

Superbone That's very helpful. Thanks!

Superbone I feel like a bad penny that keeps popping up, but I'm obviously not over the hump yet. I just did a file import with five transactions. However, when I select and try to match them under Edit, the match option is grayed out. I don't know what's causing this. Some of the transactions have different dates because they processed after the date I made (and input) the purchase. None of the imported ones have categories, but I can't imagine you would have to categorize each one before matching--that's more work than manual reconciliation! Any thoughts why Match is not available?

Friendly_gal No worries. First of all, make sure you only have two transactions selected at a time. Sometimes I forget that I have another transaction selected because I was modifying it previously. Another reason matches are disallowed is if you try to match a two imported transaction. Occasionally, I've heard of duplicate transactions importing.

I just realized that I'm sure there is support material about matching. Here, found this. See if it helps explain things:

https://www.youneedabudget.com/matchmaker-matchmaker-make-me-a-match/

Superbone Well it's definitely not as simple as they make it out to be. I have selected two (not three or more) transactions, the amount is identical, and one was manually input and the other imported. "Match" is still grayed out for all three transactions ( I got rid of the confusing Amazon ones). Guess I will have to send the issue to support. It shouldn't be this hard...

Friendly_gal There are a couple of other reasons you might not be able to get two transactions to match— Superbone mentioned two common ones! We'd be happy to take a look if you contact support.

Matthew Thank you, Matthew. I submitted a support request this afternoon.

Friendly_gal I've got Capital One as well, and can confirm that it's asking for 2FA twice.  Fortunately, I'm only using Capital One as my Money Market fund, so really only need to import and reconcile monthly, but if it were my main account, I'd be really annoyed.

Bruce Yeah, unfortunately Capital One is my main (and only) general purpose credit card. I use it for everything because I get cash rewards, which right now are helping fund my future "take my grandsons to Disneyland in style" category. 🙂 I'm currently trying the file import method, which seems like an improvement. However, I manually input everything anyway, so if the file import method ultimately disappoints, I will just go back to manually reconciling when the payment comes due. I did if for years, I can do it again. Although it irks me to pay for the import feature when it doesn't work...

Friendly_gal I can live with inputting the credentials every time and the 2FA twice, but what irritates me is that it won't even give me that option until two days have passed since the previous import. If I could at least initiate the import process after 8 hours (as purported to be the standard), I'd be happier (for a while). 

Peppr2 At least the file import option let's you request an import as frequently as you like. However, I'm having difficulty matching imported transactions and have a ticket into support. Hopefully they can resolve the issue and I can avoid direct importing until they get all the kinks out.

Friendly_gal I'll be curious to hear what the matching issue was. Keep us posted.

Friendly_gal I've never tried pulling in a file. I suppose I should do that, but it seems so unnecessary when I would be perfectly happy if things worked as advertised - auto download every 8 hours at most.

Superbone I heard back from Support. Apparently if you import a file, not only does the amount have to  match but the transaction DATE does, too. That will never happen if you manually input the day you make the transaction because, at least with a credit card, it is not possible for it to clear on the same day. Sarah acknowledged that the YNAB team knows there is work still to do in this area. 😕

As for direct import, she said that the transactions were duplicates of imported transactions that had already matched, possibly caused by the timing of the Plaid transition. I used to import daily, so I suppose that's possible. She does not expect that to continue--we shall see. If direct import remains an issue or just a pain, I will probably file import to make sure I didn't miss anything, and then just delete the imported transactions.  What a shame that such a potentially helpful feature does not work properly!

Friendly_gal I'm confused by that first paragraph. I have transactions all the time that have different dates but still match. I put in recurring transactions for all my known bills. They all direct import and match without a hitch even if the imported date is different. I was told that they have to be within 10 days of each other.

But maybe you're saying manually imported files work differently? That makes no sense to me. If that's the case, they do have a lot of work to do still.

Superbone That's exactly the case. Direct import will match within 10 days. File import must have the same date to match per Sarah in Support. I'm not sure why they would even suggest file import as an option when they know transactions won't match. Hopefully importing won't always be this painful.

Friendly_gal I don't think Sarah is right, I use file based import from time to time and have never had that be a problem. 

Faness Can we get clarification on this?

Faness 

Faness said:
It sounds like you entered transactions and matched them

 This is the part I don't understand.  I have never personally matched anything. Are you saying that the transactions automatically matched during a direct import I did before the file import? If that is the case, how would I know that the match ever took place?

Faness Or is that when I get the green "cleared" icon?

Faness Thank you for the clarification! 🙂

Friendly_gal Transactions will never match without you approving them. Once approved and matched, they can't be matched again. I agree with Faness that it may have had to do the the Plaid changeover. It may have direct imported them originally and then manually imported again in which case they can't be matched a second time.  Does that make sense?

Superbone Yes, it does. Now I just have to decide if I want to go through all the extra verifications now required by direct import, use file import instead, or just do the manual thing I've done for years when my statement arrives and  maybe try again when more of the kinks have been resolved.

Faness Thanks for the clarification. My next question is do I really have to reconnect my accounts every time I want to direct import? Both Wells Fargo and Capital One are requiring me to submit my creds twice every time I do. It is time consuming and frustrating, which is why I tried file import in the first place....

Friendly_gal I think I'd personally do the manual file import until things get fixed but that's just me. Once or twice a week at most.

My checking account wouldn't link at all for a couple weeks. My account would only export csv which I would then have to convert in order to import. I ended up just logging into my account every few days and manually entering in new transactions. Most were already covered by scheduled transactions so it wasn't too painful.

Faness Superbone  Thank you both for the recommendation. It sounds like the best compromise. I manually input transactions the same day I make them, often on the fly, because I like to stay as current as possible. FYI--Capital One has always required re-authentication with every import, but before the transition it only made me do it once, and it was quick. Now it is asking me to do the same thing twice every time and each time is much slower than it was before.  :(  Hopefully the Wells Fargo 2x requirement will go away entirely when things are fixed.

Silver Cheetah  Thanks for the feedback, I'm going to submit a Bank Importing Issue too then! I have Navy Federal and it's all been very frustrating.

Silver Cheetah I'll have to look into that. I'm a Capital One customer, too.

Friendly_gal I'm still seeing issues being reported with Capital One as recent as last month. Did switching to Mx fix this problem for you?

Din Djarin switching to MX fixed it for me

Din Djarin I don't know what they switched me to, but Capital One has been importing regularly and properly since they made the change on November 30.

Cadet Blue Drill 

How did you switch? Were you able to do something on your end, or did customer service do it per your request? Or maybe it was done automatically by YNAB?

Ivory Dragon Customer service request.  Since I knew what to ask for (account configuration change to Plaid) they knew exactly what to do. It works great now.

Cadet Blue Drill 

Thank you for the reply. I've sent a request to customer service, so fingers crossed.

Faness It wasn't either of the re-authentication or Capital One issues. There was one that was listed between those two for a while, and the last update it had had was on May 7th. It was related to the switch to Plaid and discussed the import problems. I wish I had the name of it but I don't. But it covered import issues for people who didn't have MFA problems with the new import.

Thanks!

Beige Guitar Check your spam folder. Support always responds.

Beige Guitar I responded to your other post, with some additional details on the communication we did for this migration. I'll pass your feedback along to the team, so we can improve in the future. I'm glad to see one of my colleagues is helping to get those connections restored. Let us know if you have any questions!

  I am all set! Previously i raised teh request using the Contact US page on the main webpage which is not the right way to raise a support ticket. 

https://docs.youneedabudget.com/contact

Hey Beige Guitar ! Bank connection issues do pop up as changes are made, and vary by provider or financial institution. There are a lot of moving parts, and it's something we wish could be avoided completely—but often require a bit of troubleshooting for your unique connection.

An issue with Chase was resolved this morning, so try re-establishing the connection. If that doesn't do the trick, reply to Katie's last email, and we'll dig in!

Beige Guitar I had this issue with my Chase Amazon Prime CC. I followed the instructions, "please try linking to 'Amazon.com Chase Cards' instead", and now I'm working fine again. (After a million backed up imports. 🙂)

Nicole Awesome this is also resolved and I didn't have to do the 2FA song and dance ! 

Beige Guitar So glad to hear that!